Life in OUR America, Volume 2, The Livyjr Files Options

[Livyjr]

"I think war is a dangerous place!"

- George W. Bush, Washington, D.C.; May 7, 2003

[Abu Beacon]

QUOTE(Livyjr @ Nov 9 2004, 06:36 PM)

I was recently involved in a series of back and forth e-mails with a Harvard history professor over matters involving John Kerry's military service in Viet Nam.


Anyway, the Viet Nam paradigm now, according to this Harvard history person, is that Viet Nam was really a grand and glorious undertaking by the United States, so that if people like me, who were there, have a contrary opinion, because of having been there, then, because of the "paradigm", we don't have an opinion!

If I went to Viet Nam, say, and I saw a village full of women and children burned to the ground, and I then said I saw a village full of women and children in Viet Nam burned to the ground in defense of a position taken by John Kerry that such conduct was indeed occurring in Viet Nam; then, because the paradigm says that such things never happened, then, I don't have anything valid to say, and I am dismissed as having a point-of-view, an eye-witness account eliminated because it messes up the model being used by academe, at least at Harvard, that describes Viet Nam as grand and glorious!

Thus, the Viet Nam war statistics are being purged, the history is being re-written, and in the course of that, people like me who went to Viet Nam and came back with contrary opinions on the matter are simply being expunged from the public record.
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Isn't it really, really difficult for us who down deep want absolutely nothing less than the best for and FROM our country to read Livyjr's true accounts of the stories behind the stories?

Difficult, yes, but to not believe what we know is going on would be the height of ostrich behavior. Example: Livyjr mentions above, some observations I made concerning the ugly and evil things President Nixon was caught doing and which led to his impeachment. For those younger members on this forum, who are unaware of all this, just go to Google and type in Millhouse Nixon. There is much to learn.

Most of us have an innate desire to believe the best of our leaders. We might believe something was not handled in a forthright manner but do not want to believe it was a deliberate, calculated. " There must be some extenuating circumstances. " Up to the the Nixon administration, I felt pretty much that way -- not totally naive of course -- but more than willing to " understand. " Now, I do understand. Certain things happen in a certain way because that is the way they were planned to happen.

How soon we forget!

Our elected leaders know that and count on it.

When did the public last seriously make any outcry concerning Abu Ghraib?

We watched the G.I.'s take the fall. They probably were culpable and accountable for their actions. But---Why- why - why - are we not sending letters, continually, to our Senators and Reps DEMANDING an explanation of Abu Ghraib? ( I have ) .
Does it not make us feel as dirty as the officers and civilian people who originated and condoned Abu Ghraib should feel, to go silently along with the whitewashing of these criminals. I call them criminals because they are murdering what we like to call our " American way of Life ." And that makes them criminals, to me. And we stand silently by, making little murmurs on how that is not right.

Iraq is in so many ways, Viet Nam restored. The public would not entertain the thought of the so called " UnAmerican " things we did then.

And are now doing.

And many still do not believe it.

Our administration loves to throw the term " freedom " around. Makes a big hit to the voters. Freedom. Don't we all love it?

Are we free? Are we getting freer, if there is such a word? Decide for yourself.

Ask the reporters who won't divulge the source of their confidential information.

As they have always legally done.

Back around 50 - 60 years ago, long before T.V., there was a mystery program on the radio called" THE SHADOW "

" One of the lines spoken, always in a menacing tone was " WHO KNOWS WHAT EVIL LURKS IN THE HEARTS OF MEN ?'" THE SHADOW KNOWS "

It was a scary program, then.

What is going on now is even more scary.

A.B.

This post has been edited by Abu Beacon: Feb 11 2005, 09:36 AM

[jeffmoskin]

And it is about working together, which sometimes is just not easy to do, especially when a big-time politician, right in front of you, has just accepted an offer of money, say $80,000, from a "special-interest" group, to "remove" you permanently from your position of oversight, over them!

Being somewhat younger than you, and therefore lacking in all the experience that I am yet to get in life down here on earth, I am somewhat at a loss to this day as to how to reconcile this, and go back in there and work together with these "boys" to separate the "right" of this matter from the "wrong" of it, especially when what is "right" is determined by the weight of the sack of gold put on those scales that blind justice is always seen to be holding in those quintessentially American depictions of "justice" that you see in courthouses and such places as that.

Up here, in the corrupt Empire State, the wags all say that blind justice holds those scales because "justice" really is blind to injustice, or just does not care, and so has the scales to determine who is right or wrong.

The side of the scales that goes down, which has the bigger bag of gold placed upon it, therefore tells "justice" on whose side it should be!

And when it is that way, and it is, let us not kid ourselves here, then people like me will always be the losers, at least as far as getting a chance at justice down here on this earth of ours, or that portion of it that lies within the geographical boundaries of the corrupt Empire State of New York.

But with that said, jeffmoskin, I am still with you with regard to your statement above!

It should be the hope and the goal, and therefore, it is the journey towards that "shining city" that really counts, and hence this thread, so that older Americans like you CAN COME IN HERE, and point out that path to sometimes discouraged younger Americans such as me!

You are in a tough spot, Livyjr. I may have a few years on you, but I think in many ways you have experienced a lot more learning in your years than I. However, one of the things I have come to believe is that while may be justice in the world, you will not find it in a court of law.

I have had my "day in court", and have found that a courtroom contains two professional liars (spelled' lawyers') each trying to convince a former lawyer in a black robe (who got bored with lawyering) that HE and only HE is telling the truth. The judge, having heard this crap for some 20 years, has his mind on going fishing or hunting or fixing up his house. Anything BUT the case before him. So I wish you good luck in your endeavor, but you might explore other non-judicial ways of dealing with the situation.

And I wish we had even more people "in here." As you said at the onset, WE ARE HISTORY. And what we are writing here is the story of OUR America as it has played out during our lives, with occasional reflections on the history that occurred before us which we can now access at the click of a mouse. What a miracle. My wife now refers to me as a "mouse potato." I consider it a compliment.

[jeffmoskin]

And with that said, here is a short excerpt of remarks that Mr. Bill Moyers made on National Public Radio, about "US", and what we really are doing in here, and I think that he has really hit a nail on the head here, and a necessary nail at that, so without further ado, "HERE'S BILL":

"I think the internet, the blogging, is the closest we've come in a long time to the history of the American media IN THE BEGINNING!"

"You know, in the 1820s, the 1830s, all you needed to be a journalist was to buy a press."

"That's why they called them ink-stained wretches: because they operated their own hand presses."

"For a little bit of money, like Tom Paine and others, you could have your own press."

"After the Revolution, independent journalists - printers, they called themselves - sprung up all over the country."

"THEY WERE PARTISAN BY THE WAY, VOCIFEROUSLY!"

"They attacked the others' politics, BUT IT WAS A HEALTHY PERIOD OF BOMBAST IN AMERICA IN WHICH PEOPLE COULD SORT OUT THE INFORMATION."

"I think the bloggers, then the websites, come closest TO THE SPIRIT OF CACOPHONY, TO THAT DEMOCRATIC EXPRESSION, THAT WE HAD IN THE EARLY PART OF THIS COUNTRY'S HISTORY!"

- Bill Moyers, in an interview on National Public Radio's Fresh Air

SO?

Do you wish democracy?

HERE IS WHERE IT STARTS!

With us!

Or it never will exist, but as a hope and dream, which it always has been anyways!

Without us who actualize that hope and dream, and here, I mean ALL OF YOU out there, that dream dies!

And what a shame that would be, indeed!

And we ARE having an effect. In reading this morning's NY Times, it turns out that the bloggers are responsible for getting out the story on James D Guckert, AKA Jeff Gannon, believed to be the one who outed Valerie Plame.

Democrats Want Investigation of Reporter Using Fake Name
By KATHARINE Q. SEELYE

Two Democrats in Congress are pressing for investigations into how a Washington reporter who used a pseudonym managed to gain access to the White House and had access to classified documents that named Valerie Plame as a C.I.A. operative.

The Democrats, Representatives John Conyers Jr. of Michigan and Louise M. Slaughter from Rochester, wrote yesterday to Patrick Fitzgerald, the independent prosecutor appointed in the Plame case, seeking an investigation into how the reporter, James D. Guckert, who used the name Jeff Gannon, had access to classified documents that revealed the identity of Ms. Plame.

Until Wednesday when he resigned, Mr. Guckert worked for TalonNews.com, a Web site operated by Robert Eberle, a Texas Republican. Mr. Guckert said in a March 2004 interview with his own news service, in which he was referred to as Mr. Gannon, that the classified document had been "easily accessible." The two Democrats questioned how a person with "dubious qualifications" had access to such a document. The Democrats also wrote to the Secret Service seeking an explanation of how someone using a pseudonym was cleared to enter the White House daily press briefings as well as a presidential news conference last month. They said in their letter that allowing such a person in "appears to deviate significantly from heightened security measures you have employed recently."

Mr. Guckert resigned from Talon saying he had been harassed by liberals on the Internet. Bloggers grew suspicious of him after President Bush called on him at the news conference and the reporter suggested that Democrats had "divorced themselves from reality." Spearheaded by a Web site called Media Matters For America, the bloggers discredited him.

Mr. Guckert told CNN yesterday that he had been receiving threats and hate mail. He said he used the pseudonym Gannon because it was "easier to pronounce and remember."

Scott McClellan, the White House press secretary, told reporters yesterday that Mr. Bush did not know who Mr. Guckert was. Mr. McClellan said that Mr. Guckert entered the White House under his real name and "like anyone else, showed that he was representing a news organization that published regularly, and so he was cleared two years ago to receive daily passes, just like many others are."

Mr. Guckert was denied credentials to cover Capitol Hill, where press gallery workers said that his application indicated Talon was not his main source of income and that they could not verify its legitimacy.

Karl Frisch, a spokesman for Ms. Slaughter, said: "This is a guy who could not get credentialed by the House or the Senate press galleries, and yet managed to get into the White House and question the president" and have access to a top-secret document.

He added: "To imply he has no connection to the White House is just not credible."

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/02/11/politics...print&position=

This could not have been done as recently as 10 years ago.

[jeffmoskin]

Our administration loves to throw the term " freedom " around. Makes a big hit to the voters. Freedom. Don't we all love it?

Are we free? Are we getting freer, if there is such a word? Decide for yourself.

Ask the reporters who won't divulge the source of their confidential information.

As they have always legally done.

Back around 50 - 60 years ago, long before T.V., there was a mystery program on the radio called" THE SHADOW "

" One of the lines spoken, always in a menacing tone was " WHO KNOWS WHAT EVIL LURKS IN THE HEARTS OF MEN ?'" THE SHADOW KNOWS "

It was a scary program, then.

What is going on now is even more scary.

A.B.

The CIA 9/11 commission completed its final "classified" report in August, two months before the election. This administration stuffed it in the closet, claiming it was too sensitive to release without first carefully analyzing it.

Malarky.

Here is a Letter to the Editor, in today's NY Times. I always read these because, like this blog, I find some of the most insightful comments come from the public at large:


The Unheeded Warnings of 9/11

To the Editor:

Re "9/11 Report Cites Many Warnings About Hijackings" (front page, Feb. 10):

As a criminal investigator and a security professional, I am appalled by the most recent revelations from the 9/11 commission. It is now abundantly clear that 9/11 could have and should have been prevented.

This was not a failure of intelligence or a failure to communicate. It was a failure to act. And the responsibility for this inaction rests squarely on the shoulders of George W. Bush and his administration.

Furthermore, as a citizen, I am outraged by the Bush administration's blatant abuse of power in classifying this information before the election. Withholding the 9/11 commission's complete report has in itself risked national security, while the only thing at risk from the full release of the information was President Bush's re-election.

Perhaps as Americans celebrate the potential birth of democracy in Iraq, we should pause to mourn the loss of our own.

André M. Gorelkin
New York, Feb. 10, 2005

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/02/11/opinion/...print&position=


I couldn't have said it any better.

[Abu Beacon]

[quote=Abu Beacon,Feb 11 2005, 10:33 AM]
QUOTE(Livyjr @ Nov 9 2004, 06:36 PM)

Difficult, yes, but to not believe what we know is going on would be the height of ostrich behavior. Example: Livyjr mentions above, some observations I made concerning the ugly and evil things President Nixon was caught doing and which led to his impeachment. For those younger members on this forum, who are unaware of all this, just go to Google and type in Millhouse Nixon. There is much to learn.


This posting is just to make a correction in the above section of a posting I made earlier today.

I incorrectly used the term impeachment in reference to Ex President Richard M. Nixon. Mr. Nixon was not impeached, he resigned under pressure. If he had not resigned, he was told by his own party that he would be impeached and undoubtedly found guilty.

A.B.

[Abu Beacon]

jeffmoskin, I'm with you!

Quote = Livyjr
Being somewhat younger than you, and therefore lacking in all the experience that I am yet to get in life down here on earth, I am somewhat at a loss to this day as to how to reconcile this, and go back in there and work together with these "boys" to separate the "right" of this matter from the "wrong" of it, especially when what is "right" is determined by the weight of the sack of gold put on those scales that blind justice is always seen to be holding in those quintessentially American depictions of "justice" that you see in courthouses and such places as that.
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I do not really believe that you really are at a " loss " on how to reconcile the problem you are mulling over in your mind. Your moral compass is far too strong.

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QuoteLivyjr =

And when it is that way, and it is, let us not kid ourselves here, then people like me will always be the losers, at least as far as getting a chance at justice down here on this earth of ours, or that portion of it that lies within the geographical boundaries of the corrupt Empire State of New York.
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Two words that should never be in the same sentence:

Word No. 1 >>>> Livy jr

Word No. 2 >>>> Loser

People like you Livyjr are NEVER losers. Even when you are not winning every battle, you are not losing.  I find myself being somewhat shocked that you said that. Remember your namesake --- Livius. A WINNER LIKE YOU.

A.B.
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But with that said, jeffmoskin, I am still with you with regard to your statement above!

It should be the hope and the goal, and therefore, it is the journey towards that "shining city" that really counts, and hence this thread, so that older Americans like you CAN COME IN HERE, and point out that path to sometimes discouraged younger Americans such as me!

SO!

Please!

Keep it up, jeffmoskin!

And thank you again!

[big sky brad]

"I think war is a dangerous place!"

- George W. Bush, Washington, D.C.; May 7, 2003

Who do you think told him?
<_<

[Livyjr]

Who do you think told him?

It was on the screen of a military video game that he saw, I think.

"WAR IS DANGEROUS!"

"DON'T DO THIS IN YOUR HOMES, KIDS!"

And let me extend a very warm welcome to you, Mr. big sky brad, and especially your flag, let it fly ever high in OUR skys - DO NOT TREAD ON ME!

[Livyjr]

I was recently involved in a series of back and forth e-mails with a Harvard history professor over matters involving John Kerry's military service in Viet Nam.

Anyway, the Viet Nam paradigm now, according to this Harvard history person, is that Viet Nam was really a grand and glorious undertaking by the United States, so that if people like me, who were there, have a contrary opinion, because of having been there, then, because of the "paradigm", we don't have an opinion!

If I went to Viet Nam, say, and I saw a village full of women and children burned to the ground, and I then said I saw a village full of women and children in Viet Nam burned to the ground in defense of a position taken by John Kerry that such conduct was indeed occurring in Viet Nam; then, because the paradigm says that such things never happened, then, I don't have anything valid to say, and I am dismissed as having a point-of-view, an eye-witness account eliminated because it messes up the model being used by academe, at least at Harvard, that describes Viet Nam as grand and glorious!

Thus, the Viet Nam war statistics are being purged, the history is being re-written, and in the course of that, people like me who went to Viet Nam and came back with contrary opinions on the matter are simply being expunged from the public record.

Isn't it really, really difficult for us who down deep want absolutely nothing less than the best for and FROM our country to read Livyjr's true accounts of the stories behind the stories?

Difficult, yes, but to not believe what we know is going on would be the height of ostrich behavior.

Example: Livyjr mentions above, some observations I made concerning the ugly and evil things President Nixon was caught doing and which led to his impeachment.

For those younger members on this forum, who are unaware of all this, just go to Google and type in Millhouse Nixon.

There is much to learn.

A.B.

Younger people in America are not taught about Millhouse Nixxon, A.B., according to my own surveys of younger people on that subject, BUT .....

WE, you, A.B., jeffmoskin, and me; WE WERE ALL THERE AS IT HAPPENED, and so, we saw American history being made!

In fact, we were a living part of that history!

To me, home from Viet Nam by that time, I thought that the Millhouse Nixxon business had finally pierced through this "VEIL OF HYPE" that has come to surround and characterize modern-day presidents, and especially this present incumbent, like a nimbus, or an aura!

"AMERICAN PRESIDENTS ARE NOT GODS; NOR ARE THEY GODLIKE!"

They are mortals like us!

That is why we give them ONLY four years at a time in which to be in that high office!

It is OUR high office, after all!

And now, we are back to the "CULT OF THE PRESIDENT" again, in spades!

Young people just don't know the story, A.B.; they weren't there, and the story just never got handed down!

And curious that, eh!

[jeffmoskin]

Young people just don't know the story, A.B.; they weren't there, and the story just never got handed down!

And curious that, eh!

And it is OUR JOB as the elder generation to pass that info along. Otherwise, we have not secured our future as a civilization.

We have lost control of the "public airwaves." For the most part, the younger generation would rather get its news from the "Daily Show" than from Dan Blather or Tom Brokenjaw.

(BTW, I'm not sure that's all bad)

We are left with this blog. It's new, it's exciting.

But Faux News has higher ratings.

[Livyjr]

Most of us have an innate desire to believe the best of our leaders.

We might believe something was not handled in a forthright manner but do not want to believe it was a deliberate, calculated.

"There must be some extenuating circumstances."

Up to the the Nixon administration, I felt pretty much that way -- not totally naive of course -- but more than willing to "understand."

Now, I do understand.

Certain things happen in a certain way because that is the way they were planned to happen.

A.B.

Que sera, sera, whatever will be, will be!

That is how I see life, A.B., and then, I'm never really surprised by what comes next!

It does seem that there is a wheel turning, here, however, in terms of some pretty incredible historical events all transpiring within the space of OUR lifetimes!

You, A.B., and then jeffmoskin, have seen incredible changes that would fill a book in the telling, and would probably be dismissed by many as simply incredible tales spun by a pair of old men.

Unless I miss my bet, A.B., you had to have lived through part of the depression, and jeffmoskin's parents had to have direct experience of that same period that they would have passed on directly to jeffmoskin, as my parents did with me!

Your parents, A.B., probably had direct experience with WWI, and that would have shaped them in ways that then shaped you.

When I was young, I picked eggs at the neighbor's farm, and his mother would serve me lunch, when the family ate.

I was twelve or so.

She was around ninety as I recall.

It was incredible for me to listen to her talk of the times that she had lived through as a young girl, right in that same place, as originally, she had lived as a girl in the farm house right closest to ours.

Now, young people do not have this kind of access to people like this old woman, who was still very vital when I knew her!

Everything that we take for granted WAS GONE when this woman was but a young girl in that country, and jeffmoskin can attest to what the cold can be like at times up here in this country in the winter, especially back then, for winters now are less harsh than once they were, in my experience of them, anyway.

SO!

Our lives are shaped in ways that are much different than many of those who came after us, the younger generations, in here, and out there, as well, and it is interesting to see those ways that shaped us so, emerging in here, for all the world to be able to share the experiences of someone like you, A.B., when you were but a young boy, here in OUR America.

How the times were then!

What you saw through your young eyes as a boy!

What you heard with your young ears, from the radio news of the day!

Speak of these things, if you will, A.B.!

It will serve to give us some perspective in here, is my thought on that, anyway, A.B., and I am for that!

[Livyjr]

And it is OUR JOB as the elder generation to pass that info along.

Otherwise, we have not secured our future as a civilization.

We have lost control of the "public airwaves."

For the most part, the younger generation would rather get its news from the "Daily Show" than from Dan Blather or Tom Brokenjaw.

(BTW, I'm not sure that's all bad)

We are left with this blog.

It's new, it's exciting.

But Faux News has higher ratings.

jeffmoskin, I truly believe that we are in the middle of a miracle here, myself, in that what should not by rights be able to happen, that being separate and disparate entities such as you, and A.B., and big sky brad, and me, holding this conversation, AT ALL; IT IS WHAT IS HAPPENING INSTEAD!

Absent a miracle, how else this thread in here, and this forum for this thread to even be in?

And so, in my way of seeing life, this miracle occurs when it is needed, and so, here we all are!

And you have defined the purpose of the miracle above, very well, jeffmoskin!

To pass on the lessons of real, live history, as a compass to guide the paths of those who would go wisely into our collective future!

Hence this thread!

[jeffmoskin]

When I was young, I picked eggs at the neighbor's farm, and his mother would serve me lunch, when the family ate.

I was twelve or so.

She was around ninety as I recall.

It was incredible for me to listen to her talk of the times that she had lived through as a young girl, right in that same place, as originally, she had lived as a girl in the farm house right closest to ours.

The benefits of "multigenerational living."

I think we took a giant leap backward when we jumped in our cars and headed for the burbs.

Back in the 70s there was a progam called "The Waltons." Cornball I know, but this was a multigenerational family all living under one roof. What they lacked in material goods was more than made up for with family unity.

[Livyjr]

The benefits of "multigenerational living."

I think we took a giant leap backward when we jumped in our cars and headed for the burbs.

Back in the 70s there was a progam called "The Waltons."

Cornball I know, but this was a multigenerational family all living under one roof.

What they lacked in material goods was more than made up for with family unity.

And it is something more than just family unity, jeffmoskin.

It is a sense of continuity, and community, and enduring!

I know as a young person that when I would listen to this old woman tell me of her life when she was young, I would realize, even at that age, just how "good" I had things, compared to how they could have been, BUT FOR .......

We don't seem to have that anymore, do we, the "BUT FOR ...."?

[Livyjr]

"I think war is a dangerous place!"

- George W. Bush, Washington, D.C.; May 7, 2003

And to show Mr. George W. Bush just how right he is when he says this above:

Middle East - AP

"Four Dead After U.S. Convoy Attacked"

19 minutes ago

BAGHDAD, Iraq - Insurgents attacked a U.S. convoy and a government building near the northern Iraqi city of Mosul, leaving at least four people dead, hospital workers said.

Two Iraqi National Guard troops were also killed while trying to defuse a roadside bomb.

Insurgents fired on the convoy in Al-Qahira district, just north of Mosul, sparking a battle that left at least four people dead and two wounded, doctors at the Al-Jumhuri Teaching Hospital said.

Insurgents also fired a rocket at the governor's building in Mosul, killing one woman and one man, as well as injuring four others, officials at the hospital said.

Two Iraqi National Guard troops were killed on Mosul's airport road while trying to diffuse a roadside bomb, police said.

U.S. and insurgent forces have fought fierce battles in recent days in Mosul, 360 kilometers (225 miles) northwest of Baghdad.

Fierce clashes broke out Saturday after American troops, responding to a mortar attack on one of their bases, were attacked with small arms and rocket-propelled grenades by insurgents inside a mosque, U.S. officials said.

The insurgents disabled a U.S. Army tank and a Stryker armored vehicle during the battle, which raged for hours around the mosque, Lt. Col. Erik Kurilla said.

U.S. troops killed nine insurgents but suffered no fatalities, Kurilla said.

end quotes

And so, here we are over in "Life in OUR America", Vol. II, and we still have as one of our background "issues" in here, the George W. Bush Holy War.

I wonder for how many more volumes that will continue to be the case?

[Livyjr]

Middle East - AP

"Four Dead After U.S. Convoy Attacked"

BAGHDAD, Iraq - Insurgents attacked a U.S. convoy and a government building near the northern Iraqi city of Mosul, leaving at least four people dead, hospital workers said.

U.S. and insurgent forces have fought fierce battles in recent days in Mosul, 360 kilometers (225 miles) northwest of Baghdad.

Fierce clashes broke out Saturday after American troops, responding to a mortar attack on one of their bases, were attacked with small arms and rocket-propelled grenades by insurgents inside a mosque, U.S. officials said.

The insurgents disabled a U.S. Army tank and a Stryker armored vehicle during the battle, which raged for hours around the mosque, Lt. Col. Erik Kurilla said.

U.S. troops killed nine insurgents but suffered no fatalities, Kurilla said.

"This foreign policy stuff is a little frustrating!"

- George W. Bush, as quoted by the New York Daily News; April 23, 2002

[Livyjr]

And we ARE having an effect.

In reading this morning's NY Times, it turns out that the bloggers are responsible for getting out the story on James D Guckert, AKA Jeff Gannon, believed to be the one who outed Valerie Plame.

"Democrats Want Investigation of Reporter Using Fake Name"
By KATHARINE Q. SEELYE

Two Democrats in Congress are pressing for investigations into how a Washington reporter who used a pseudonym managed to gain access to the White House and had access to classified documents that named Valerie Plame as a C.I.A. operative.

Scott McClellan, the White House press secretary, told reporters yesterday that Mr. Bush did not know who Mr. Guckert was. Mr. McClellan said that Mr. Guckert entered the White House under his real name and "like anyone else, showed that he was representing a news organization that published regularly, and so he was cleared two years ago to receive daily passes, just like many others are."

Mr. Guckert was denied credentials to cover Capitol Hill, where press gallery workers said that his application indicated Talon was not his main source of income and that they could not verify its legitimacy.

Karl Frisch, a spokesman for Ms. Slaughter, said: "This is a guy who could not get credentialed by the House or the Senate press galleries, and yet managed to get into the White House and question the president" and have access to a top-secret document.

He added: "To imply he has no connection to the White House is just not credible."

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/02/11/politics...print&position=

And thanks for catching this one, jeffmoskin!

It came up on my radar, BUT ...

I missed the connection with Valerie Plame!

And with respect to your statement about "making a difference", I just finished that book "The Power of Many" by Christian Crumlish, and in the concluding pages, he had this quote from a man named Howard Rheingold, as follows:

"It has taken 10 years of talk about 'new media' FOR A CRITICAL MASS to understand that every computer desktop, and now every pocket, IS A WORLDWIDE PRINTING PRESS, broadcasting station, place of assembly, and organizing tool - AND TO LEARN HOW TO USE THAT INFRASTRUCTURE TO AFFECT CHANGE!"

According to Rheingold, and here, I would say my own observations are somewhat in sync with this, "convergence", in here, is "reviving the town square, and producing political mini-parties."

In another observation made to the author of the book "The Power of Many", Rheingold said, and this is of direct relevance to this thread itself, and one of its underlying purposes, that:

"There has been a non-physical world for a very long time."

"There wouldn't have been a U.S. Revolution WITHOUT COMMITTEES OF CORRESPONDENCE."

Of interest as well is Rheingold's observation that "the Protestant Reformation was a vitual world in many ways, BUILT AROUND THE PRINTING PRESS," because Gutenberg's Bible ushered in the era THAT DEVOLVED CONTROL OVER THAT ANCIENT TEXT and distributed it, OPENING UP THE REALM OF DISCUSSION AND INTERPRETATION to literate people in all the written languages of Europe, and eventually, the world.

SO!

With that all said, it is my observation, after further experience with this thread, that we, the old folks in here, have two distinct advantages on OUR side:

a) we have come, in life, to realize that good things are not built overnight; and

b) we have the patience to wait!

And we also have sufficient experience of life now, to realize that good and bad exist at all times, and theorectically, at least, in all things, and so, it is up to us as to how we make these "qualities" manifest themselves, which is a direct function of how we put ourselves "forth" to the world, each moment of each and every day.

As to having people in here, jeffmoskin, THEY ARE!

They come in, they look around, sometimes they stay!

Change is a process, like all others, and it happens when and as it will.

Ours, I think, is to just keep stimulating that process by asking people to ask questions themselves!

And so, hence this thread!

LIVE!

Late-breaking.

Life, in OUR America!

And for more on Mr. Rheingold:

http://inthesetimes.com/comments.php?id=414_0_1_0_M

http://www.edge.org/documents/questions/q2....html#rheingold

[Livyjr]

SO!

With that all said, it is my observation, after further experience with this thread, that we, the old folks in here, have two distinct advantages on OUR side:

a) we have come, in life, to realize that good things are not built overnight; and

b) we have the patience to wait!

And we also have sufficient experience of life now, to realize that good and bad exist at all times, and theorectically, at least, in all things, and so, it is up to us as to how we make these "qualities" manifest themselves, which is a direct function of how we put ourselves "forth" to the world, each moment of each and every day.

As to having people in here, jeffmoskin, THEY ARE!

They come in, they look around, sometimes they stay!

Change is a process, like all others, and it happens when and as it will.

Ours, I think, is to just keep stimulating that process by asking people to ask questions themselves!

And so, hence this thread!

"Oftentimes, we live in a processed world - you know, PEOPLE FOCUS ON THE PROCESS and not results!"

- George W. Bush, Washington, D.C.; May 29, 2003

[Livyjr]

The CIA 9/11 commission completed its final "classified" report in August, two months before the election.

This administration stuffed it in the closet, claiming it was too sensitive to release without first carefully analyzing it.

Malarky.

Here is a Letter to the Editor, in today's NY Times.

I always read these because, like this blog, I find some of the most insightful comments come from the public at large:

Patience!

Persistence!

Tenacity!

All necessary elements, or ingredients, perhaps, of the process of change, Mr. jeffmoskin!

And it must start with us!

If these "qualities" are of no value to us, and if "need for change" is not apparent to us, then we will convince nobody of anything at all!

If we talk just to make the global warming problem a little worse, then we will not change any minds out there at all, nor will we serve as a vehicle for affecting change.

We, jeffmoskin; you, me, A.B.; we are a "Committee of Correspondence" ourselves, just like in the very beginning days of OUR America, and so, we need to learn about that process ourselves, even as we are the direct participants in that process.

Time!

For bread to rise before baking, time is always the final ingredient!

If you don't have it, or can't, or won't allow for it, don't try to bake bread!