Life in OUR America, Volume 2, The Livyjr Files Options

[Livyjr]

Livyjr, I assume the question "Where will George W. Bush lead us to?" is a rhetorical question.

Because, as you say, nobody knows, not even G.W.B.

The bigger question, in my mind, is "Why does anybody follow him?"

A.B.

And there is a question that continues to tear OUR America into factions, that one of why anyone at all anymore still believes a single word George W. Bush and his have to say, about anything.

Some of the people in OUR America feel that it is alright to have as president a man who is not doing any worse than anyone else could do the job, while some of us want someone who should have been able to do the job, better than anyone else in OUR America.

And there the twain are!

Geese never follow a leader that does not know where he is going, or at least geese who survive the journey south don't anyway, and that seems to be something left to us humans, exclusively, to follow a leader who hasn't the slightest idea of where he is, let alone where anything is going, like the fate of OUR nation!

"Oh Livyjr, get off George W. Bush's case for once here, will you, he's not doing any worse than anyone else could do, you know!"

AND yes, actually, I do!

[Livyjr]

Unfortunately, Imperial Caesar will lead us into Syria, then Saudi Arabia.

It's all about oil.

And empire.

And POWER, jeffmoskin!

It's about power, too, but then, they all are about the same, aren't they?

Power, oil, and empire?

[Livyjr]

QUESTION: HOW DO THE REPUBLICANS DEAL WITH ETHICS PROBLEMS?

ANSWER: THEY DO AWAY WITH THE ETHICS RULES, AND THEN THEY SAY "WHAT ETHICS VIOLATIONS CAN YOU POSSIBLY BE TALKING ABOUT?"

And speaking of "TWO-GUN TEXAS TOMMY" DeLay, what's the latest from him?

Let's look and see:

Top Stories - Reuters

"Senior Republican Says DeLay Won't Quit as Leader"

Sun Apr 17, 3:14 PM ET

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - A senior House Republican said on Sunday he thought embattled Majority Leader Tom DeLay would stay on in his post despite the cloud of ethical allegations swirling around him.

"Tom DeLay will stay as leader," said Rep. Roy Blunt of Missouri, the No. 3 Republican in the U.S. House of Representatives.

"Tom DeLay is not going to run away from a fight," he told NBC's "Meet the Press."

DeLay was admonished by the House ethics committee last year on three separate matters involving what critics said were strong-armed political tactics.

In recent weeks more allegations have arisen over ties to lobbyists, foreign trips funded by outside groups, and payment of salaries to DeLay's wife and daughter.

Two House Republicans have suggested DeLay should step aside, while some other Republicans, including former House Speaker Newt Gingrich, say he needs to explain his actions to the country.

DeLay has denied any wrongdoing.

He showed a typically combative streak over the weekend when he talked about the allegations against him and then referred to Sarah Brady, the wife of the former White House press secretary Jim Brady, who was shot in the assassination attempt against former President Ronald Reagan.

"Sarah Brady said that when a man's in trouble or in a good fight you want all your friends around them, preferably armed," DeLay said in a speech to the National Rifle Association.

"So I feel really good."

One House Democrat said while he agreed DeLay might not be about to quit, Republicans were unlikely to want him to continue as their leader in the 2006 congressional elections.

"My guess is that he will not quit soon and that I do not think he will be a candidate for leader in the next Congress."

"I think that too many Republicans will decide that this is a problem in marginal districts," Rep. Barney Frank, a Massachusetts Democrat, said on "Meet the Press."

Blunt meanwhile rejected suggestions that DeLay should hold a news conference or go on television to answer allegations of ethical misconduct.

"My impression is he has not done anything wrong," Blunt said, adding that the ethics committee was "the best place for him to make that case."

DeLay has said he is eager to appear before the House ethics panel to answer questions.

But Democrats, in protest, have not allowed the panel to organize since Republicans voted to change its rules in a way Democrats claim would weaken the committee's ability to investigate lawmakers.

[jeffmoskin]

I think we need to put ethics back into Congress...

Without Delay.

[amy]

I think we need to put ethics back into Congress...

Without Delay.

Good one, jeff!

[Livyjr]

Good one, jeff!

Hi, amy!

And welcome!

Nice of you to put in your two cents, here!

Where, oh, where, have ethics gone in OUR America?

Or were they ever here in the first place?

I think about that a lot, as it really is a "human condition" kind of question that affects the lives of each and every one of us, not only in OUR America, but in the whole world as well, since we all are inter-connected, as George W. Bush's INVASION of Iraq makes vividly clear to me, at least, as if I needed that reminder after suffering two head wounds in Viet Nam, "interconnecting" with those folks over there and the deadly RPG-7, back in 1969!

I'm reading a book right now about the American Revolution, which cites heavily from the various "founders", including John Adams, and Abigail, of course, and Thomas Jefferson, and I would say from that study alone that "ethical" government was very much on the minds of the "founders" of this nation at the time of the Revolution, so, where have we lost it, then, that spirit that existed at the time of this nation's founding?

At the time of the American Revolution, which was really a last choice in the minds of many at that time, one of the real "roadblocks" to "reconciliation", at least as I understand it, not having actually been there to experience it directly myself, was the sheer corruption of the English government of that time.

In fact, if you study back to the English Rebellion, or whatever it really was, of a hundred or so years before, when the English themselves pulled down their own king, and took off his head, corruption in English government was already rampant and a causative factor in that occurrence, so that by 1775, there was indeed little hope left, if any, that if America reconciled with England, instead of decalring independence, that the corruption underlying the "troubles" would go away!

SO!

We tossed out a foreign despot!

And now where are we?

Got a bunch of local ones, instead!

SO?

How about that for "evolution", will you?

We've "evolved" ourselves right back into the "primal ooze" from whence we emerged as a nation, some two hundred and more years ago, and "natural selection" has given us "TWO-GUN TEXAS TOMMY" Delay as OUR highest and best in OUR congress!

Is God playing tricks on us here?

Is this a "cosmic joke"?

Is the "coyote" gone wild, "trickstering" all over the place with wild abandon?

OR ...

Is this for real?

Questions for OUR times!

LIVE!

Here in OUR America!

Stay tuned!

The "ROUND TABLE" is in place, and the discussions have begun!

Developments as they happen, and no, you don't have to watch a small pipe to see if smoke is issuing out, for OUR deliberations in here are quite open, public and transparent, as is befitting a democracy, where we would all by personal choice, wish to reside, IF ONLY WE HAD ONE!

Hence this forum, hence this thread!

And have a nice day, besides!

As for me, I'm going up on the "roof", and if I don't fall right on down on my head, like "NEWTON'S APPLE", well, I'll see you all in a bit!

And I look forward to the occasion!

amy, jeffmoskin, Mr. A.B., well said all!

to be continued ........

[Livyjr]

And here it is, the end of another day, and I am just now sliding in the door, here, to leave a word or two behind, before another day departs us all.

Another beautiful day up here, where I am, and I do not want to waste that day by thinking on anything else, to be truthful.

What a blessing this weather has been, and what a surprise, to have this many cloudless days in a row, and relatively still, as well.

I'm trying to get outside, myself, and get my old bones moving around, a little more each day, which is how I have to do things, by easing into them, little by little.

I've been "superintending" my copper job, as I have been saying, and my method of superintending is to get myself right out of sight after giving out instructions, and let the person have some peace to do the work in!

I know I hate to have someone hovering around when I am trying to focus on a task which must be done, and so, I don't do that to another, and that seems to work out alright, for me, anyway, as the work is getting done, and the person doing it is at his ease, which you have to be when doing that type of work!

Detail work, that is!

Things that fit exactly, and look to the eye afterwards as if they do!

We were standing on the ground looking up at a newly finished corner of a fascia cover and the gable end cover, and even from that distance, or more likely, especially at that distance, you could see how nice and square that corner really was.

I was thinking today that God must like to do some metal work himself, elsewise, why would we have copper?

[jeffmoskin]

I've been "superintending" my copper job, as I have been saying, and my method of superintending is to get myself right out of sight after giving out instructions, and let the person have some peace to do the work in!

O that all superintendants might have learned from you, Livyjr.

[Abu Beacon]

Where, oh, where, have ethics gone in OUR America?

Or were they ever here in the first place?

I truly believe, and I also I am fairly sure that I have made this known in more than one post on this forum, that ethics here in the U.S. have been declining for some time, BUT they took a huge downward movement during the Nixon administration.

That is the impression I have had for a long time.

It was probably inevitable since his ethics, his credibility, and his morals were so far off the mark where most people thought a presidents ethics ought to be.

It's just the same as in a big company.

When people know that the top man is a crook, it's easier for them to be the same way.

BTW ----- Columnist Bob Herbert of the N.Y. Times had a great article on FDR today. I posted it on the " George Bush Vs. Franklin D. Roosevelt " thread.

You might want to read it.

A president the people could look up to and respect.

A.B.

[jeffmoskin]

BTW ----- Columnist Bob Herbert of  the N.Y. Times had a great article on FDR today. I posted it on the " George Bush Vs. Franklin D. Roosevelt " thread.

You might want to read it.

A president  the people could look up to and respect.

A.B.

I did read it. One of his best.

[Livyjr]

I truly believe, and I also I am fairly sure that I have made this known in more than one post on this forum, that ethics here in the U.S. have been declining for some time, BUT they took a huge downward movement during the Nixon administration.

That is the impression I have had for a long time.

BTW ----- Columnist Bob Herbert of  the N.Y. Times had a great article on FDR today.

I posted it on the "George Bush Vs. Franklin D. Roosevelt" thread.

You might want to read it.

A president  the people could look up to and respect.

A.B.

As I continue to study OUR history as a nation, which overwhelms me yet, especially the earliest days, I learn more and more about what is known of the founders themselves, through their own writings, about their own thoughts at that time, concerning independence, or reconciliation with England, and recently, I came across a paragraph that Thomas Jefferson wanted in the body of the Declaration of Independence that basically excoriated the English people themselves for being responsible for the government that was inflicting tyranny and depotism, and repression on OUR America, AS, the English people were the ones responsible for the corruption in the English Parliament that translated to tyranny and despotism, and repression in America.

I too, Mr. A.B. thought that Nixxon represented a real water shed in American presidential politics, but thinking like Jefferson at the time of the writing of the American Declaration of Independence, I have to wonder how such a decline in ethics could be possible in OUR America without the knowledge and consent of the American people, themselves!

And Nixxon was a lawyer, was he not?

There is where ethics have really taken a nosedive here in OUR America, with all of these lawyers that we now have permeating OUR governments from the level of the local dog catcher, right on up and through the school boards, and right on into the White House itself.

And just this morning, I heard an old-time Judge from up here in my area being interviewed on the radio about this thing in OUR America with BUSH CONSERVATIVE JUDGES, and this Judge made the comment that lawyers are having other lawyers appointed to all of these various judgeships across this nation of ours, to do what the lawyers want, and not what is good for us as a people, and as a nation!

Interesting!

Refreshing!

And right on point, to boot.

[Livyjr]

BTW ----- Columnist Bob Herbert of the N.Y. Times had a great article on FDR today.

I posted it on the "George Bush Vs. Franklin D. Roosevelt" thread.

You might want to read it.

A president  the people could look up to and respect.

A.B.

And for you readers of this thread who may not be familiar with Mr. A.B.'s other thread, here is that Bob Herbert article for your convenience:

April 18, 2005
OP-ED COLUMNIST

"A Radical in the White House" By BOB HERBERT

Last week - April 12, to be exact - was the 60th anniversary of the death of Franklin Delano Roosevelt.

"I have a terrific headache," he said, before collapsing at the Little White House in Warm Springs, Ga.

He died of a massive cerebral hemorrhage on the 83rd day of his fourth term as president.

His hold on the nation was such that most Americans, stunned by the announcement of his death that spring afternoon, reacted as though they had lost a close relative.

That more wasn't made of this anniversary is not just a matter of time; it's a measure of the distance the U.S. has traveled from the egalitarian ideals championed by F.D.R.

His goal was "to make a country in which no one is left out."

That kind of thinking has long since been consigned to the political dumpster.

We're now in the age of Bush, Cheney and DeLay, small men committed to the concentration of big bucks in the hands of the fortunate few.

To get a sense of just how radical Roosevelt was (compared with the politics of today), consider the State of the Union address he delivered from the White House on Jan. 11, 1944.

He was already in declining health and, suffering from a cold, he gave the speech over the radio in the form of a fireside chat.

After talking about the war, which was still being fought on two fronts, the president offered what should have been recognized immediately for what it was, nothing less than a blueprint for the future of the United States.

It was the clearest statement I've ever seen of the kind of nation the U.S. could have become in the years between the end of World War II and now.

Roosevelt referred to his proposals in that speech as "a second Bill of Rights under which a new basis of security and prosperity can be established for all regardless of station, race or creed."

Among these rights, he said, are:

"The right to a useful and remunerative job in the industries or shops or farms or mines of the nation."

"The right to earn enough to provide adequate food and clothing and recreation."

"The right of every farmer to raise and sell his products at a return which will give him and his family a decent living."

"The right of every businessman, large and small, to trade in an atmosphere of freedom from unfair competition and domination by monopolies at home or abroad."

"The right of every family to a decent home."

"The right to adequate medical care and the opportunity to achieve and enjoy good health."

"The right to adequate protection from the economic fears of old age, sickness, accident and unemployment."

"The right to a good education."

I mentioned this a few days ago to an acquaintance who is 30 years old.

She said, "Wow, I can't believe a president would say that."

Roosevelt's vision gave conservatives in both parties apoplexy in 1944 and it would still drive them crazy today.

But the truth is that during the 1950's and 60's the nation made substantial progress toward his wonderfully admirable goals, before the momentum of liberal politics slowed with the war in Vietnam and the election in 1968 of Richard Nixon.

It wouldn't be long before Ronald Reagan was, as the historian Robert Dallek put it, attacking Medicare as "the advance wave of socialism" and Dick Cheney, from a seat in Congress, was giving the thumbs down to Head Start.

Mr. Cheney says he has since seen the light on Head Start.

But his real idea of a head start is to throw government money at people who already have more cash than they know what to do with.

He's one of the leaders of the G.O.P. gang (the members should all wear masks) that has executed a wholesale transfer of wealth via tax cuts from working people to the very rich.

Roosevelt was far from a perfect president, but he gave hope and a sense of the possible to a nation in dire need.

And he famously warned against giving in to fear.

The nation is now in the hands of leaders who are experts at exploiting fear, and indifferent to the needs and hopes, even the suffering, of ordinary people.

"The test of our progress," said Roosevelt, "is not whether we add more to the abundance of those who have much; it is whether we provide enough for those who have too little."

Sixty years after his death we should be raising a toast to F.D.R. and his progressive ideas.

And we should take that opportunity to ask: How in the world did we allow ourselves to get from there to here?

E-mail: bobherb@nytimes.com

[Morambar in TX]

> Frist Holding Simulcast Event at KY Church, People of Good Faith Needed to Protest
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no retreat, no surrender
post Apr 15 2005, 01:09 AM
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Senator Frist is trying to use Religion to divide us. Please get the word out at your churches, synagogues & mosques. We need to have people of good will from all Religious persuasions to stop this distortion. For those of us like me who are not religious we too have to be involved. This issue is crucial to maintaining an independent judiciary.

In the article below it says that this event will be held at a Kentucky Church. I researched and found out that it will happen at Highview Baptist Church in Louisville, KY (where I live). We will be organizing in Louisville to show them that we are not rolling over on this. Please organize protests in your own cities. Send letters to the editor at the time of this event so that all those that see this simulcast in their churches or on their local news will know that the community is NOT with these fanatics.

April 15, 2005
Frist Set to Use Religious Stage on Judicial Issue
By DAVID D. KIRKPATRICK

WASHINGTON, April 14 - As the Senate heads toward a showdown over the rules governing judicial confirmations, Senator Bill Frist, the majority leader, has agreed to join a handful of prominent Christian conservatives in a telecast portraying Democrats as "against people of faith" for blocking President Bush's nominees.

Fliers for the telecast, organized by the Family Research Council and scheduled to originate at a Kentucky megachurch the evening of April 24, call the day "Justice Sunday" and depict a young man holding a Bible in one hand and a gavel in the other. The flier does not name participants, but under the heading "the filibuster against people of faith," it reads: "The filibuster was once abused to protect racial bias, and it is now being used against people of faith."

Organizers say they hope to reach more than a million people by distributing the telecast to churches around the country, over the Internet and over Christian television and radio networks and stations.

Dr. Frist's spokesman said the senator's speech in the telecast would reflect his previous remarks on judicial appointments. In the past he has consistently balanced a determination "not to yield" on the president's nominees with appeals to the Democrats for compromise. He has distanced himself from the statements of others like the House majority leader, Tom DeLay, who have attacked the courts, saying they are too liberal, "run amok" or are hostile to Christianity.

The telecast, however, will put Dr. Frist in a very different context. Asked about Dr. Frist's participation in an event describing the filibuster "as against people of faith," his spokesman, Bob Stevenson, did not answer the question directly.

"Senator Frist is doing everything he can to ensure judicial nominees are treated fairly and that every senator has the opportunity to give the president their advice and consent through an up or down vote," Mr. Stevenson said, adding, "He has spoken to groups all across the nation to press that point, and as long as a minority of Democrats continue to block a vote, he will continue to do so."

Some of the nation's most influential evangelical Protestants are participating in the teleconference in Louisville, including Dr. James C. Dobson, founder of Focus on the Family; Chuck Colson, the born-again Watergate figure and founder of Prison Fellowship Ministries; and Dr. Al Mohler, president of the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary.

The event is taking place as Democrats and Republicans alike are escalating their public relations campaigns in anticipation of an imminent confrontation. The Democratic minority has blocked confirmation of 10 of President Bush's judicial nominees by preventing Republicans from gaining the 60 votes needed to close debate, using the filibuster tactic often used by political minorities and most notoriously employed by opponents of civil rights.

Dr. Frist has threatened that the Republican majority might change the rules to require only a majority vote on nominees, and Democrats have vowed to bring Senate business to a standstill if he does.

On Thursday, one wavering Republican, Senator John McCain of Arizona, told a television interviewer, Chris Matthews, that he would vote against the change.

"By the way, when Bill Clinton was president, we, effectively, in the Judiciary Committee blocked a number of his nominees," Mr. McCain said.

On Thursday the Judiciary Committee sent the nomination of Thomas B. Griffith for an appellate court post to the Senate floor. Democrats say they do not intend to block Mr. Griffith's nomination.

That cleared the way for the committee to approve several previously blocked judicial appointees in the next two weeks.

The telecast also signals an escalation of the campaign for the rule change by Christian conservatives who see the current court battle as the climax of a 30-year culture war, a chance to reverse decades of legal decisions about abortion, religion in public life, gay rights and marriage.

"As the liberal, anti-Christian dogma of the left has been repudiated in almost every recent election, the courts have become the last great bastion for liberalism," Tony Perkins, president of the Family Research Council and organizer of the telecast, wrote in a message on the group's Web site. "For years activist courts, aided by liberal interest groups like the A.C.L.U., have been quietly working under the veil of the judiciary, like thieves in the night, to rob us of our Christian heritage and our religious freedoms."

Democrats accused Dr. Frist of exploiting religious faith for political ends by joining the telecast. "No party has a monopoly on faith, and for Senator Frist to participate in this kind of telecast just throws more oil on the partisan flames," said Senator Charles E. Schumer, Democrat of New York.

But Mr. Perkins stood by the characterization of Democrats as hostile to faith. "What they have done is, they have targeted people for reasons of their faith or moral position," he said, referring to Democratic criticisms of nominees over their views of cases about abortion rights or public religious expressions.

"The issue of the judiciary is really something that has been veiled by this 'judicial mystique' so our folks don't really understand it, but they are beginning to connect the dots," Mr. Perkins said in an interview, reciting a string of court decisions about prayer or displays of religion.

"They were all brought about by the courts," he said.

Democrats, for their part, are already stepping up their efforts to link Dr. Frist and the rule change with conservatives statements about unaccountable judges hostile to faith.

On Thursday, Mr. Schumer released an open letter calling on Dr. Frist to denounce such attacks. "The last thing we need is inflammatory rhetoric which on its face encourages violence against judges," he wrote.

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/04/15/politics...artner=homepage


QUOTE
FRC Action Simulcast To Target Filibusters

Join FRC Action on Sunday, April 24, as we host a nationwide, live simulcast to engage values voters in the all-important issue of reining in our out-of-control courts.

This exciting event will be held at Highview Baptist Church in Louisville, Ky. and will be broadcast in churches throughout the nation. Speakers include Dr. James Dobson, Dr. Al Mohler, and Chuck Colson.
Read Tony Perkins' message here.

Register using the links below, and find out how you can participate in this historic event!

For more details check out our thread in online cafe

http://www.commongroundcommonsense.org/for...&st=0&p=258219&



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Morambar in TX
post Apr 16 2005, 08:56 AM
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Sounds like a great idea; do you think a week is enough time for our various state leaders to put together a nationwide protest? I would be shocked and amazed if Hyde Park Baptist here in Austin isn't in on it, and they're already really popular for their attempt to force people out of their homes so they can build themselves a parking garage (whose home would Jesus demolish?)

Isn't it sad that I had to wait this long, and it was John McCain, a REPUBLICAN, who made the same observation I've made all along.


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NO PEACE WITH THE SHADOW! "The Wheel of Time" Robert Jordan
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Morambar in TX
post Apr 16 2005, 09:14 AM
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After thought: Frist is of course expecting a very friendly audience. This may not be possible with a mega-church, but imagine if we got there early (there and around the country) and filled the place. How would THAT play on nationwide TV? Normally I would be VERY averse to the political takeover of a church, but it appears too late to prevent that. If it's going to BE political, the pews should be filled by proportional representation. Maybe they'll just tell us we're not welcome in the house of God; that'll be entertaining too.

This post has been edited by Morambar in TX: Apr 16 2005, 09:14 AM


--------------------
Love can't be coerced.
NO PEACE WITH THE SHADOW! "The Wheel of Time" Robert Jordan

"Ask and ye shall receive." Note that there is a topic on online cafe for those who wish to address it exclusively (as well as several in Religion In Politics and the KY sub-forum of Southern States; frankly, I'm concerned that we may be diluting our efforts.) OK, I'm off to move statuary, then I have an LTE to write so they'll have time to get it in by Sunday (the Austin Chronicle will print tomorrow, and that's where it would really do the most good here.)

[jeffmoskin]

Bump!

Looks like the mods have been doing Spring Cleaning.

[Livyjr]

Frist Holding Simulcast Event at KY Church, People of Good Faith Needed to Protest!

Senator Frist is trying to use Religion to divide us.

Please get the word out at your churches, synagogues & mosques.

We need to have people of good will from all Religious persuasions to stop this distortion.

For those of us like me who are not religious we too have to be involved.

This issue is crucial to maintaining an independent judiciary.

Thanks, Morambar, for bringing this matter over to here!

And for all of you out there who do stop by here on your daily way through life, here in OUR America, and the world as well, I would ask you all to take a moment to "study" through what Morambar has posted here.

Never in my recollections of OUR nation's history has OUR REPUBLIC and OUR DEMOCRACY been so ENDANGERED as it is right now, by this CONSERVATIVE crowd, including "TWO-GUN TEXAS TOMMY Delay, and this Frist, who wants CARTE BLANCHE for the CONSERVATIVES to be able to do whatever they wish, whenever, with us having no RECOURSE at all to stop them, BY THE EXPEDIENCY of having BUSH JUDGES seal off the FEDERAL COURTS TO US, so that we cannot get these matters before a JURY of OUR Peers!

Of course, if JUSTICE means nothing to you, then Morambar's post will be a waste of your time, BUT ....

If you are that person, then you likely aren't in here in this FORUM, or thread, in the first place, and so .....

Please take a moment and read this important post, as April 24 IS this weekend, and so, time is getting short to make your voices heard.

And thank you for caring about what is in reality YOUR NATION!

[Livyjr]

Never in my recollections of OUR nation's history has OUR REPUBLIC and OUR DEMOCRACY been so ENDANGERED as it is right now, by this CONSERVATIVE crowd, including "TWO-GUN TEXAS TOMMY" Delay, and this Frist, who wants CARTE BLANCHE for the CONSERVATIVES to be able to do whatever they wish, whenever, with us having no RECOURSE at all to stop them, BY THE EXPEDIENCY of having BUSH JUDGES seal off the FEDERAL COURTS TO US, so that we cannot get these matters before a JURY of OUR Peers!

Of course, if JUSTICE means nothing to you, then Morambar's post will be a waste of your time, BUT ....

If you are that person, then you likely aren't in here in this FORUM, or thread, in the first place, and so .....

Please take a moment and read this important post, as April 24 IS this weekend, and so, time is getting short to make your voices heard.

And thank you for caring about what is in reality YOUR NATION!

I wonder how many people in America right now could name either a Federal Court Judge or a State Court Judge in their state?

Or even know they exist, let alone where that may be?

Judge's have a literal power of life and death over us in so many different ways, and most of us do not even know who these judges are, or how they ever got to be one!

To me, the JUDICIARY is the most important BRANCH of government, here in OUR America, far more so than either the executive or the legislative, because it is ONLY the judiciary that can really protect OUR Constitutional rights against usurpations by the executive or the legislative branchs.

For that to be so, the JUDICIARY MUST BE INDEPENDENT, and they are not!

More and more, they are mere appendages hanging off the gross underbelly of the political parties, like so many fobs on a watchchain, to do the party's bidding!

And we, the citizens of this nation, we are the ones that let it happen!

Through OUR ignorance that it is even happening, while our lives go on, on a day to day basis!

Then, one day, our rights are curtailed, and then, they are gone!

Just like that!

SO!

Anyone just stopping by, please give Morambar's post above a read, and if in any way you can join that "effort", it would be a good thing for DEMOCRACY in OUR America!

And this disabled veteran says, thank you for that!

[Livyjr]

And here's one of those "things" that just happened to "flash" through my "sights" when I first turned on the computer this afternoon, and it's title intrigued me, and so, I have capured it for here, for whatever in the end it may be worth:

Business - AP

"NYSE to Merge With Archipelago Holdings"

15 minutes ago

By MICHAEL J. MARTINEZ, AP Business Writer

NEW YORK - The 213-year-old New York Stock Exchange vaulted into the top ranks of electronic stock trading Wednesday, announcing a merger with all-electronic rival Archipelago Holdings Inc. in a stunning move that will also transform the NYSE into a for-profit, publicly traded enterprise.

The deal answers one of the pressing needs facing the NYSE, which has battled increasing competition from faster all-electronic exchanges like the Nasdaq Stock Market as well as Archipelago.

The NYSE conducts its transactions through a specialist auction system, in which trades are made through people on its selling floor.

The NYSE's 1,366 seat holders, its current owners, will receive $400 million in cash and 70 percent of the shares in the new company, while Archipelago's shareholders will retain 30 percent of the shares, NYSE Chief Executive John Thain said at a news conference.

"This is an essential step to maintaining our global competitiveness and leadership," Thain said.

Using the NYSE's latest seat sale — $1.62 million — as a guide, the NYSE is roughly valued at $2.2 billion.

Archipelago is valued at $844 million using Friday's closing stock price.

The new entity, a holding company to be called NYSE Group Inc., will spin off the NYSE's regulatory arm — recently invigorated after coming under intense criticism for failing to stem a floor-trading scandal — into a not-for-profit oversight entity.

That part of the deal answers the demands of some NYSE members who have been agitating for the exchange to turn for-profit in order to better compete as a business.

"I think the regulatory structure we're proposing will be a model for other self-regulating agencies," Thain said.

ArcaEx Chairman and CEO Jerry Putnam said the merger would create new opportunities for NYSE Group to expand its trading into other areas, including options and other equity derivatives.

The exchange will not trade Nasdaq-listed stocks on the floor of the NYSE, but will continue to trade them through ArcaEx's electronic market.

The NYSE also will continue its plan to create a hybrid market, combining its floor trading with an enhanced electronic system under development.

The merger also improves the NYSE's ability to compete following the Securities and Exchange Commission's approval earlier this month of Regulation National Market System.

The regulation requires stock traders to accept the best bid or offer available, no matter which stock exchange or market posted it — but customers could go to another market if they want to complete trades as quickly as possible.

This option makes the pre-merger NYSE less competitive.

Thain will remain CEO of NYSE Group, while Putnam will become president and co-chief operating officer.

The management teams of the two companies will be integrated, Thain said, and a transition team is already working on the deal.

NYSE Chief Financial Officer Amy Butte will become executive vice president of strategy and product development, while Archipelago CFO Nelson Chai will assume that role for the NYSE Group.

Pending regulatory approval, the merger is expected to be completed in either the fourth quarter of this year or the first quarter of 2006, Thain said.

Three ArcaEx board members will join the NYSE board.

The company will continue to be headquartered at its iconic Wall Street building in New York.

The deal is a major coup for Thain and a boost for a stock exchange that in recent years has been most notable for the controversy over the $187.5 million pay package given former Chairman and CEO Richard Grasso.

Thain became CEO in early 2004, several months after Grasso's forced resignation.

The move mollifies many of the exchange's seat holders, who had saw their seats decline to $975,000 in value earlier this year from $2.65 million in 1999.

Some of the decline has been attributable to the uncertainty of the stock market during that time, but the increasing competition facing the NYSE has likely been a factor as well.

"I knew this is where they had to go."

"What surprises me is that they did it so quickly and in this format, but I'm pleasantly surprised," said Tom Caldwell, chairman of Caldwell Asset Management Inc. and a seat holder and frequent critic of the NYSE.

"I'm going to have to find someone else to fight."

"I haven't seen enough to have had any concerns, but this is a very interesting deal, and I'm glad John Thain caught on to the vision we had for the exchange."

Chicago-based Archipelago trades both stocks and options based on stock holdings.

Archipelago handles about 25 percent of the trades in stocks listed on the Nasdaq, but has made little impact in handling NYSE stocks, where more than 80 percent of listed stocks trade on the floor of the exchange.

With the Nasdaq reportedly in talks to acquire Instinet, another electronic exchange owned by Reuters Group PLC, the stage is set for the NYSE and Nasdaq to compete head-on in the U.S., while also giving the NYSE Group a stronger global standing, according to Vincent Phillips, chief executive of Schwab's CyberTrader subsidiary.

"I think this will be great for retail investors and institutions, because you know the NYSE and the Nasdaq are going to compete very aggressively," Phillips said.

"Yes, it reduces the number of players in equity markets."

"You'd rather have 10 really large players instead of two, but I think the benefits will outweight that concern."

Shares of Archipelago surged 11 percent, or $1.86, to $18.76 on the Pacific Stock Exchange, a regional exchange affiliated with Archipelago, before trading was halted due to pending news.

Shares have traded in a 52-week range between $11.50 and $22.90
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On the Net:

New York Stock Exchange: http://www.nyse.com

Archipelago Holdings Inc.: http://www.tradearca.com/default.asp

[jeffmoskin]

I hear the sound of snouts moving towards the trough.

[Morambar in TX]

The Archipelago/NYSE merger is just another in a long string of consolidations over the past decade, but is troubling since it represents an escalation; now we have not only the consolidaton of the corporations that control the country, and, through it, the world, but cosolidtaion of the means by which THEY are controlled. The process of consolidation-liquidation of America has just kicked to a higher gear by people who wrap themselves in the flag and polish their crosses while worshipping greed and not caring what happens to America as they loot it.

[Livyjr]

The Archipelago/NYSE merger is just another in a long string of consolidations over the past decade, but is troubling since it represents an escalation; now we have not only the consolidaton of the corporations that control the country, and, through it, the world, but consolidation of the means by which THEY are controlled. 

The process of consolidation-liquidation of America has just kicked to a higher gear by people who wrap themselves in the flag and polish their crosses while worshipping greed and not caring what happens to America as they loot it.

First of all, welcome to the "ROUNDTABLE", Morambar!

And here, I have to go with jeffmoskin's comment about "snouts" to the trough, which is a simpler version of what you are saying right above here.

Some years ago, now, and it is hard to say exactly when that was, but let us say for me, about the mid-1970's, I realized that in OUR day and age, such a thing as the LOOTING of OUR nation could actually take place, despite alleged "safeguards" supposedly put in place by what is alleged to be OUR government, and that in fact, such looting was not only possible, but was actually on-going, right then and there, and not even really out of sight, just out of the minds of most people, who were and are too distracted by the "day-to-day" stuff, or gambling now, more likely, to look around them to see what was really going on in our communities.

In New York State, where I am, and where the NYSE is also located, according to a Governor's Approval Memorandum for a bill to allegedly combat "white-collar crime" in New York State, BY 1976, "white collar crime" in New York State was already more than FORTY-FOUR BILLION DOLLARS!

And spiraling ever upward, as "economic crime has become increasingly profitable and sophisticated!"

According to the Governor of New York at that time, and this was 1986, ten years later, and who knows how many BILLIONS more in economic crime, "greedy, white collar profiteers WILL NOT BE STOPPED until we adopt strong measures to stop them!"

Now, all I can say here, is "Yeah, right, governor, and when is that going to happen?"

FORTY-FOUR BILLION DOLLARS!

In play!

And where is that money going to go?

And who is going to look too hard, when it does?

A politician?

Yeah, right, again!

And now, Morambar, there is not even pretense made!

Pedal to the metal, full speed ahead!

SO!

State sponsored GAMBLING in New York State is now the big thing, as who takes a look at where the money going through a state-sponsored gambling den really comes from?

And the money is "clean", when it comes out the other side, and the looters are in their ascendency now, and heaven, too, since there are all these outlets now in place, thanks to the state, to launder this ill-gotten money!

As to OUR democracy?

Well, we never had one in the first place, did we, and so, what is there to lose?