For several reasons, I have been very inactive on this forum for almost two years.

I mention this only because being out of the loop for this length of time has resulted in my not knowing if this subject has been discussed here and if so, to what degree and depth.

I am asking for any comments and opinions about this controversial subject.

If there is anyone here who can briefly post a comment or opinion or knowledge on this, I would appreciate your input, no matter how brief or extensive.

Of course I do read or watch the national news, but I would value the opinion and/or feelings of those right here to help me get up to date.

Thank you all. I wish I could say that I understand this bill much more than I do now.

A.B.

Hello, Mr. A.B.

Welcome back.

As far as I know, the so-called "health care plan" has morphed into an "insurance company support plan". That is, BHB is suggesting that all Americans be REQUIRED to possess health insurance (self provided or employer provided). The government plans to "help" those low-income people pay for it if they can't afford it. Insurance companies would be prohibited from excluding people based on risk factors or prior conditions.

Beyond that, there are few details. The "public option" (e.g., single-payer like Medicare) is off the table.

My own opinion is that we could get a lot more health care for a lot less money.

But my plan would be John Conyers' HR 676.

Single payer.

Plain and simple.

Thanks, Jeff

That's exactly the type of response I am looking for. Hope I can get more.

A.B.

Mr. A.B......Sure is great to see you back!!

As far as details of health care options, I think Jeff has provided you a great nutshell overview.

All I can add is my own opinion. The insurance industry has inundated this debate with such undue influence, the whole spirit and intent of health care reform has been massacred. At this point, with what's left on the table to consider, I'm as confused about it as ever!

one of the members of this very board recently had an almost fatal accident on the road, and was unemployed due to the economy with NO health insurance whatsoever.
Almost dying, the emergency room he was taken into had to take him, and he was in hospital for a little while, before they kicked him out
unceremoniously with nothing but the $90,000 plus bill, as he had NO health insurance leaving him with broken ribs, nose and jaw they did not fix.
(and that poster is someone who has worked hard, sweated, toiled his entire life).

I myself pay $2750 a month in insurance
any change that comes will be better than it is now

There have been so many lies by the political action committees and the republicans and the blue dog democrats.
100% total lies.

There will be a bill

at the very least, they will change the system so that if one loses their job, they keep their insurance.
If one takes a NEW policy out, they will have to accept you regardless of prior condition or illness.
and they will put in some way to lower the costs

If only those things are the change, that alone will be more than anyone has expected now

Whether or not there is a public option included (and it will be a choice, not manditory), will depend on the senate itself

It is a shame Ted Kennedy took ill. Because his voice is sorely missed in cutting through the red tape, and in getting a bill through the senate.
He would have been able to bring over some republicans wanting to share the glory of America seeing a new system

(and polls still show, when the poll is worded correctly, that 77% of the USA public WANTS to have more choices in their decision making process
on insurance, includinjg a public choice with the other in place choices. (And if you like your insurance, you will be allowed to keep it).

by the way-
this is something I have seen recently under an article somewhere-and how true it is

(note-I did not write this, I am just cutting/pasting this


"According to the Institute of Medicine, more than 18,000 Americans die every single year due to a lack of access to health care. That is the equivalent loss of life of SIX Sept. 11 attacks every single year. Everyone who supports the system as it currently exists is culpable for those deaths, and we should regard the insurance companies themselves as terrorists worse than Al Qaeda.
This linked program examines the experiences of three individuals with limited access facing health care crises. Their experiences demonstrate how our system is responsible for the deaths of patients. Multiply these individuals by 18,000 every year to begin to imagine the magnitude of the suffering that our system inflicts on the citizens of this country.
Then each of us should remember our own vulnerability to this system because even if you have insurance, through recision, insurance companies can drop you when you get sick. Every dollar they spend on care cuts into their profits, and they care more about making dollars than your well-being. Here is the link to POV's 'Critical Condition' as televised on Bill Moyer's Journal. Please watch it whatever your position on this issue.:
http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/index-flash.html "

The powers that be recognize that a critical mass has developed in the country demanding reform of
the current health care system...Their strategy has been to co-opt just enough reform to kill the
socio-political movement to legislate universal not for profit health care with an emphasis on Wellness
(HR676 and S703), often refered to as Single Payer...

The Obama-backed legislation that is making its way through Congress would be a significant improvement over the current system if all the provisions in the House version stays intact...

On the other hand if the public option and/or employer mandate are dropped, the powers that be will have won because they will have co-opted (and killed) the reform movement without significantly changing the system...I believe it would be better that no bill were passed this session and re-group for a more effective campaign next year...

I second this Abu. (BTW welcome back). If all that would be passed is a watered-down sham let it fall.

So many lies have been told. The Liars are so energized on this issue fueled by 1.7 million insurance lobby dollars a day they are breaking all previous records for lies per minute. Lies as we know can circle the world before the truth gets its boots on. I say let those who are for the status quo articulate their proven "wisdom" and let the American people swallow it once again. And let them listen to the further lies when real reform is killed about how the Republicans and Blue Dogs were really FOR reform but not "this" reform. And let the truth slowly catch up and let the liars continue to talk. And let us see their faces and their lying mouths recorded on tape for posterity's sake and for once let the American people remember those faces when they go to the polls.

Sorry for the anger - just my opinion.

Half the time I agree - let it fall but pin it on the Repubs and Blue Dogs and hope for a change in 2010.

The other half of the time I say let SOMETHING pass, ANYTHING at all. Obama is such a good salesman he will convince us it was a big success, get re-elected, and spend his second term putting some real health care into law.

Jeff....well put!

I'm watching Chuck Schumer and Orin Hatch being interviewed by David Gregory on MTP right now.

I'm not a huge fan of Gregory's, but I think he had a real moment with Hatch just a bit ago. He asked Hatch if the Republicans are trying to make health care reform Obama's "Waterloo" so they will have a better chance of winning back legislative seats in the mid-term elections. Hatch answered with the standard political spin of which both sides of the aisle are frequently guilty.

This time, though, I think the substance of Gregory's question really hit the nail on the head.

Eleanor Clift on MacLaughlan just punched out the ditzy Monica Crowley by saying
"he will get change however, it won't be the change the republicans want" which is why they are fighting so hard to block anything

remember, had in 1993 something gotten done, it would have been much easier to enact even more later on, but 1993 was such a failure

Thanks, Cat.

And, BTW, speaking of HEALTH as opposed to insurance and medical procedures, Michael Pollan spoke to the World Affairs Council in SFO last month.

He ties together the (highly subsidized) western agribusiness diet with the four KNOWN, and ENTIRELY PREVENTABLE diseases which consume 40 percent of spending on fixing our ailments:

http://wacsf.vportal.net/?fileid=5850

Looks like Nicholas Kristof has been reading Michael Pollan, too:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/23/opinion/...tml?ref=opinion

Read this and think about how it is the case that we could completly reform the health
care system and completly miss the whole concept of WELLNESS which is much more critical
to establishing a sustainable human social system...

A.B.
Good to see you here!

The House healthcare reform bill is here....an easy read the way it is organized:

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c111:H.R.3200:

The Senate Finance Committee is working on containing costs...

The "public option" is the "hot spot".....we shall see what happens with it. I'm strongly in favor of a PO.

Without the "Public Option" there is no health care plan.

Only an Insurance Company Health Plan.

It will be interesting to see what happens....there will be some changes for the better even without the PO. So, I want the PO included but if it's not, I don't want to see the effort abandoned.....get some changes and go from there.....in this case, I believe some movement in a positive direction is better than doing nothing at all...."holding out' for the "ideal".

With the crap the repugnant republicans have been throwing around, , any healthcare reform bill passing will be a major miracle,,

Mike Ross, representative of Ar.'s 4th Congressional district, stated Thursday, "I seem to have offended the far right and the far left"..."I think that could be an indication I've struck the right balance." What he failed to say is that 20% of the residents of his district are without any insurance coverage, which compares with 17.5% for the state and 15.4% for the nation...What he also failed to say is that his top contributors for the 2010 election and for his entire congressional career, according to the Federal Election committe information from the Center for Responsive Politics. This is how the Blue Dog Democrats play the role of power broker (instead of representing the people who elect them)
and help maintain the Tryanny of the Middle...

Why am I not surprised?

States With Most Uninsured Most Likely To Believe Euthanasia, Govt. Takeover Myths

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/08/20/s...e_n_263988.html

Obama, the great communicator, is letting this one get away. Already, a lot of progressive Dems are vowing to vote AGAINST any H/C plan that does NOT have a PO component.
That's all he needs - total opposition from the Repubs, total opposition from the Blue Dogs. and defections from the 13 million who put him in office.

Wake up, Obama, and smell the septic tank. It is starting to overflow.

Maxine Waters has announced that she will vote AGAINST any Obamacare bill that does not have single payer/public option.

Others will follow.

I think any democrat in Congress who doesn't take this position should be apposed strongly by all other democrats.
Better to fix the party than to pass any one bill by a particular time...