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XicanoPwr
Throw Down Your Cross
By John Gorenfeld, Gadflyer.

This wintry season, as the faithful continue to receive alarming reports from the news that Republicans are all that stand between them and the outlawing of Christmas itself by hordes of secular humanists, the two presidents Bush have endorsed a powerful conservative interest group specializing in removing the cross – not from schools or courthouses, but from churches.

Rather than the traditional egg hunt, this group, calling itself the American Clergy Leadership Conference, sponsored a nationwide "Tear Down The Cross" day for Easter, 2003. Last week, leaders in this radical cause presided over a Washington prayer breakfast featuring messages of thanks from the presidents. Former Sen. Bob Dole came in person.

Mostly African American, pastors who joined in 2003's ACLC-sponsored "Tear Down The Cross" won gold watches from the wealthy group, which unabashedly claims in its publications to have stripped churches of over a hundred crosses over the Easter holiday alone. This, movement leaders said, cleared the way for a new age and second messiah.

Speaking of messiahs, make a quick stop at the Web site of the ACLC, and it's clear there's more to it than the "rapidly growing movement of clergy committed to the endeavor of making this nation the best that it can be," as the ACLC described itself in a Dec. 8 Washington Times op-ed. It's actually a vehicle for Sun Myung Moon, the billionaire conservative donor who calls himself the True Father.

Though the breakfast boasted two other "co-sponsors," both are easily identifiable as projects of the self-declared Messiah: the International and Interreligious Federation of World Peace and the American Family Coalition, which Moon founded in 1984. How much more eminent these names sound than "the Moonies"! In the 1970s, that was the shorthand on the evening news for Moon's followers, whose frank call for crushing Western democracy, combined with success in recruiting teenagers, made them a popular nightmare on the evening news.

On Wednesday, a video file containing the elder President Bush's message to the ACLC disappeared from the movement's web site, though both Bush endorsements were reported in the Washington Times. Neither the White House nor the ACLC returned requests for comment on the breakfast and President Bush's participation.

Taking out the Trash

One series of photos found on Moon's Web site, but purged after receiving unfavorable attention earlier this year from evangelicals, shows Massachusetts preacher John Kingara taking down the cross from his church, hauling it behind the old brick building and hoisting it into a dumpster. Another shows a ritual in Israel disposing of the cross in the earth.

Kingara, embracing the ACLC's new gospel, declared in remarks found in the Unification News, "The fact that the cross is a symbol of division, shame, suffering and bloodshed prove that it is not of God but Satan." He continued, "On this 18th day of April 2003, we are beginning a new history. Pastors, please, help me to bring the cross down, because it is not of God but the devil."

Cheerfully pitched to pastors as "trade your cross for a crown," Moon's rebate plan takes its name from a 1913 hymn with a somewhat different slant. Whereas "The Old Rugged Cross" pines for salvation in heaven, Moon offered the pastors the possibility to cash in here on earth, at a taxpayer-funded Senate building. At a secret March 23, 2004 ceremony, he declared he was erecting heaven on earth. That evening, the elderly Korean eminence behind the ACLC was brought the twinkling crown by bowing Congressman Danny K. Davis (D-Ill.).

Moon was no accidental VIP that night. Far from being on the fringes of Washington, he's the supermogul behind a political and media empire that includes the Washington Times and United Press International, as well as being a longtime friend of the Bush family.

In Moon's teachings, God himself is shedding tears over mankind's obsession with the cross, which prevents us from recognizing the real "returning lord": Moon himself. It's no secret. This is something he's patiently explained to many audiences of congressmen and former Republican presidents over the years, in Washington pageants that hardly ever make the news.

Moon was keynote speaker last week, declaring in remarks reprinted by the Times that "God's heart is under confinement." In some ways it was a repeat performance of the Senate coronation ceremony, which The New York Times editorial page compared to an act of the mad emperor Caligula.

You may remember that Sen. John Warner and other congressmen unloaded on Moon's entourage for "deceiving" them into sponsoring a ceremony where America "surrendered to [Moon] in the king's role," according to an internal church memo. "America is saying to Father, 'please become my king,'" claimed Moon minister Chung Kwak. The versatile Kwak is currently wearing a second hat as head of the UPI news agency, added to Moon's collection of media properties in 2000.

Strangely enough, last week the hosts of the "surrender" ceremony weren't blasted but blessed by two presidents of the United States. The same faces were there: George Stallings, Jr., the flamboyant ex-archbishop who bellowed at the March dinner for America to open up its heart to Moon; Michael Jenkins and Chang Shik Yang, hosts of past "Tear Down The Cross" rituals; and former Democratic D.C. representative Walter Fauntroy, who shares the Moonies' opposition to gay civil unions (Moon calls gays "dung-eating dogs"; Fauntroy calls same-sex marriage "an abomination"). Congressman Davis did not attend.

Like the Senate party, this conference climaxed with a new Crown of Peace awarded to Moon by his own organization, though in this case they held off on the royal treatment until the following evening. The award was reported by UPI.

According to a report in the Washington Times as well as video found on the Moon-affiliated Web site FamilyFed.org, the elder Bush made a taped appearance before the ACLC's 3,000-strong crowd, which he thanked for their work. "I thought about parachuting into the building," he joked about wishing he could make it. And he paid lip service to Moon's unwieldy religious jargon, using phrases like "peace centered on God," a goal that he called "right on target."

His son, George W. Bush, wrote a warm letter of support presented at the event by a state senator, in which the president and his wife Laura sent his best wishes to the sponsors – and thanked them for rallying his "armies of compassion." It is unclear what the ACLC has done for society's problems, though its Web site is selling a video called "Beyond The Cross," and an affiliated Moon front group, Free Teens USA, has received almost half a million dollars under Bush's abstinence-only program.

Last year, as word seeped out of a movement with billions in the bank, exchanging gifts and promises of financial security for the rejection of Protestant beliefs, more mainstream, born-again Christians, like radio host Vic Eliason, were horrified. He warned on his nationally-syndicated program CrossTalk that the ACLC was ushering a false teacher into the houses of belief. Others speculated Moon was the Antichrist. But how many listeners knew that the false teacher's phone number might as well be programmed into George H.W. Bush's mobile phone?

Wouldn't Be Prudent

The elder Bush once explained his cooperation with Moon's Unification Church to the Washington Post, through a spokesman, as follows: "this group is about strengthening the family and that's what President and Mrs. Bush are deeply focused on." Well, after a fashion. Moon preaches that Jesus failed to start a family, which is why God is "confined," as he said Tuesday – grieved by his son's having blown it for mankind, with the Nazi Holocaust a punishment for the Jews' failure to unite behind the King of the Jews.

And so Moon says he's building a new kingdom centered on "absolute family-ism," referring to his True Family of sworn followers. In the past, his new sons and daughters have rejected their own families to join Moon, who handpicks mates for them to marry at his mass weddings. One ex-member is Cathryn Mazer, whose grieving family was filmed in 1993 by the "Today Show" as they tried without success to enter a Moon dormitory where Cathryn was staying. She says photos of Moon with Bush played a major role in the seminar that indoctrinated her into the cult – used to sell potential converts on the legitimacy of Moon.

"If someone told you about it, it would seem too far-fetched to be plausible," she says.

Yet the friendship is well-documented. Reuters reported in the mid-'90s that the elder Bush trekked to Argentina as a paid spokesman for Moon, whom he introduced as "the man with the vision." During the Clinton years, Bush also tagged along with Moon's speaking tour in Japan, where the former president had kind words for his strange bedfellow, an ex-convict. Bush is estimated to have received upwards of $1 million for these appearances. Moon also gave $1 million to Bush's presidential library. And when Bush was vice president, it was a generous check from Moon that opened Oliver North's Contra Freedom Fund.

But Washington conservatives are most thankful to Moon for lavishing more than $2 billion on the money-losing Washington Times. The paper was an important building block in the construction of the alternative, Republican media machine as we know it today. But many conservatives were quietly uneasy – fretting that a pact was being made with the devil. At a 1997 Washington Times anniversary dinner, the elder Bush made a video appearance similar to Monday's, crediting the paper with winning the Cold War, and similarly sharing a stage with Moon, who claimed then that he had founded the Times to save the world.

In Monday's video, Bush declared: "I want to salute a man I respect: Wes Pruden," referring to the Times editor, whose paper frequently publicizes Moon projects that most newspapers would ignore. On December 7 he ran a piece by ACLC Rev. Donnie McLeod, who has argued for the removal of the cross in sermons covered by Unification Church publications.

The cross-disposal theologian wrote: "as the president is now free from the election concerns and can never be reelected, he can now build a legacy for America and the world." ACLC leaders, he said, "are ready to see the president as I see him, a man to God who is truly ready to make the sacrifices and commitments to create a legacy of faith and family that will guide our nation for the next 200 years."

The Washington Times Foundation is slippery to define, an organization with multiple public faces that morphs when convenient into the ACLC and other religious organizations. The Senate coronation, for example, was booked under the name of the foundation, though it was treated as a photo opportunity for the South Korean religious arm of the church, which trumpeted it as the U.S. government's official stamp of approval on plans for the future of Christianity.

A former Times editor, James Whalen, told me that the protean nature of the group makes it easy to involve national-level figures in "showcasing" Moon – yet conveniently allows politicians to claim, for example, that they only dropped by to lift a glass to the awesome investigative reporting of Times reporter Bill Gertz.

And meanwhile, at the other end of the invisible line between mainstream and eldrich, there is the ACLC and its persistence in seeing the Christian cross disposed of like nuclear waste. A month after Easter last year, the group flew holy men from all over the world to a graveside in Israel, where undertakers had draped a cross beneath the blue and yellow flag of Reverend Moon, and buried the cross forever – another casualty at the hands of the armies of compassion.

Spurred on by the likes of Bill O'Reilly, conservatives are outraged at the war against Christianity supposedly declared in department stores' "Happy Holidays" signs. But secularism is one thing, and sacrilege is something else, especially coming from Sun Myung Moon's cult, which indulges dreams of becoming the state religion. The president has built his reputation on being a good Methodist, but he rarely attends church, come to think of it. And he has cozied up to a desecration spree that Tim LaHaye couldn't make up in his "Left Behind" books. Is he what he pretends to be?

http://www.alternet.org/election04/20812
XicanoPwr
American Clergy Leadership Conference
(an affiliate of the United Federation of Churches)

Statement of Purpose
1. To unify the body of Christ (the Christian churches).

2. To foster denominational unity and embrace all religions.

3. To dissolve racial barriers by practicing the principle of loving one's enemies.

4. To provide moral direction for America and its leaders.

5. To promote the blessing of marriage and the end of divorce as well as strengthening family ties and cultivating a healthy environment for youth in the family and the community.

6. To bring salvation through our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.

7. To actively participate in the renewal of the community by working together with people of faith and other organizations to address the needs of the people.

8. To acknowledge and invite the Holy Spirit to work and then inspire and direct the people of the nation.

9. To work for an environment of living for the sake of others.
PaineInTheArse
Are Moon's activities even on the radar screens of mainstream/non-fundamentalist churches and synagogs and mosques?
XicanoPwr
QUOTE
Moon Shadow
(June 2001)
With Help From Congressional Republicans And The Bush 'Faith-Based' Initiative, Controversial Korean Evangelist Sun Myung Moon Is Trying To Expand His Religious-Political Empire
By Rob Boston

At first glance, the invitation many clergy and community leaders around the country received last April to attend conferences on "Faith-Based Initiatives For Family and Community Renewal" might have looked like it came from the Republican congressional leadership and the Bush administration.

The material, decorated with a drawing of the U.S. Capitol, noted that the events would include a satellite broadcast of a GOP-sponsored "faith-based summit" for clergy transmitted live from the Library of Congress in Washington, D.C., and said that prominent congressional leaders and White House staffers would take part.

The flyer promised that the "cutting edge program" would "provide the latest information on innovative policies and programs from the Executive and Congressional leadership in Washington; and build alliances for faith-based services at the state and community level."

Meanwhile, in Washington, D.C., U.S. Rep. J.C. Watts, the House Republican Conference Chairman, was issuing press releases noting that the GOP's "faith-based" summit would be viewed by satellite at events in over 45 cities.

But if invitees took the time to read the fine print on the flyers touting the local gatherings, they would have learned that the get-togethers were sponsored not directly by the Republican Party but on its behalf by a group called the American Leadership Conference (ALC).

Reading further, they would have found out that the ALC is a project of the American Family Coalition and The Washington Times Foundation both front organizations for the Rev. Sun Myung Moon, a controversial Korean evangelist and founder of the Unification Church. The "faith-based summit" itself was sponsored by Watts (R-Okla.), Sen. Rick Santorum (R-Pa.) and other top congressional Republicans, but efforts to promote it at the grassroots level were turned over to a Moon organization.

Why is the Republican Party working hand in glove with Moon front groups? The partnership stems largely from Moon's phenomenal ability to make inroads in GOP and Religious Right circles. Despite his unorthodox theological views Moon teaches that he is the new Messiah, sent by God to complete the failed mission of Jesus Moon has had little difficulty penetrating the upper echelons of American conservatism.

While a number of Republican-aligned private organizations have promoted President George W. Bush's religion funding scheme, only Moon won an official relationship with the Republican leadership to rally grassroots forces on behalf of the "faith-based" summit. This enhanced status enabled him to do grassroots political organizing and religious recruitment with the apparent blessing of Bush and his GOP allies in Congress.

Just a few years ago, Moon announced he was ready to give up on the United States, but the change of administrations in Washington seems to have sparked a change of heart in him. Frederick Clarkson, a journalist who has studied Moon and other far-right movements, notes that Moon specializes in the creation of "Astroturf organizations" groups that appear to have grassroots power but that in reality speak mostly for Moon. Moon has used these groups to curry favor with Republicans for more than 30 years, Clarkson said, and is revving them up again to help the new Bush administration.

"Whenever the conservatives identify an issue as important to their agenda, Moon creates an Astroturf organization to create the appearance of grassroots support for these initiatives," Clarkson said.

Moon also has great influence among Capitol Hill Republicans through his ownership of the ultra-conservative Washington Times newspaper. Although the paper has never turned a profit, Moon has subsidized its operations since he founded the publication in 1982. Gradually, it has become an important outlet for conservatives eager for a vehicle to spread their views. Through the related Washington Times Foundation, Moon holds opulent seminars, dinners and other events that attract the top names in the Religious Right, clergy and political leaders.

Over the years, Moon has played host to Religious Right bigwigs like Jerry Falwell, Ralph Reed, Gary Bauer and Beverly LaHaye. He has also paid high fees to ex-presidents Gerald Ford and George Bush to speak at Moon events.


http://www.au.org/site/News2?page=NewsArti...d=5684&abbr=cs_

It is very long and very interesting.
XicanoPwr
Moon-Related Funds Filter to Evangelicals
by John W. Kennedy
http://www.ctlibrary.com/ct/1998/feb9/8t2082.html

Affiliates of Sun Myung Moon, controversial leader of the Unification Church, have a history of supporting and courting conservative evangelicals. Now, according to published reports, financial support has been filtered to Liberty University from Moon-related enterprises. But Liberty founder Jerry Fallwell told Christianity Today that the source of the funds does not influence his ministry.

"If the American Atheists Society or Saddam Hussein himself ever sent an unrestricted gift to any of my ministries," Falwell says, "be assured I will operate on Billy Sunday's philosophy: The Devil's had it long enough, and quickly cash the check."

While Moon may not be the Devil, Christians contest Moon's claim that he is destined by God to complete an unfulfilled mission of Jesus. Moon claims Jesus failed as the Messiah because he did not wed and have children. The divorced 78-year-old Moon says he and his current wife, Hak Ja Han Moon, 53, are the "true parents of all humanity."

$3.5 MILLION GIFT: In November, the Los Angeles Times reported that the Women's Federation for World Peace (WFWP), which is headed by Moon's wife, contributed $3.5 million to Christian Heritage Foundation (CHF) of Virginia for "educational purposes" in 1995.

WFWP chair Susan Fefferman says Falwell spoke monthly to a group of professional women forging Japanese-American friendships. Fefferman says that in return WFWP provided scholarships for "many, many students" through the CHF. She told CT that Falwell "made it clear" that he represented CHF and the $3.5 million could be sent there on behalf of Liberty.
XicanoPwr
Rev. Moon Connection to Klaus Barbie/Nazi's

I hope that Robert Parry stays safe. He has exposed alot of muck on the Bushies.


This is excerpted from Robert Parry's book Lost History (pages 200-203):

Moon's Korea-based church got its first boost as an international organization when Kim Jong-Pil, the founder of the Korean Central Intelligence Agency, brokered a relationship between Moon and one of Japan's leading rightist financiers, Ryoichi Sasakawa. Sasakawa had been jailed after WWII as a war criminial, but was freed, along with Yoshio Kodama , by U.S. military intelligence officials eager to enlist their help in combatting leftist political forces in Japan.......

In the early 1960's, Kim Jong-Pil's intelligence contacts with these right-wing leaders proved invaluable to Moon, who had made only a few converts in Japan. After Kim Jong-Pil opened the door to Kodama and Sasakawa in late 1962, 50 leaders of an ultra-nationalist Japanese Buddhist sect converted en mase to the Unification Church, giving it a strong base in Japan that remains to this day.....

Through WACL and other political relatioships, Moon built bridges to right-wing forces in South America during the 1970's. As DEA agent Michael Levine noted in his book Deep Cover, the DEA arrested Jose Robeto Gasser in May 1980 for allegedly smuggling 854 pounds of cocaine base. To Levine's amazement, Gasser, the son of a Bolivian WACL leader, 'was almost immediately released' for what Levine suspected were geopolitical reasons. Gasser's father was a leading figure in the coup to overthtrow Bolivia's left-of-center government. The putsch on July 17, 1980, became known as the Cocaine Coup because it gave the drug lords free rein of the country and allowed protected shipments of coca base in Columbia.

Among the well-wishers arriving in La Paz to congratulate the new government was Moon's top lieutenant, Bo Hi Pak. The Moon organization was so proud of its new contacts that it published a photo of Pak meeting with Gen. Luis Garcia Meza, the new ruler. After the visit to the mountainous capital of Bolivia, Pak declared: " I have erected a throne for Father Moon in the world's highest city."

According to later Bolivian government and news paper reports, a Moon representative invested about $4 million in preparations for the coup. CAUSA, one of Moon's anti-communist organizations listed as members nearly all the leading Bolivian coup-makers.

Shortly after the putsch, the neo-fascist shock troops recruited by fugitive Nazi Klaus Barbie , moved into the business of transporting cocaine for the drug lords. "The paramilitary units, conceived by Barbie as a new type of SS, sold themselves to the cocaine barons," wrote German investigative reporter Kai Hermann. "The attraction of fast money in the cocaine trade was stronger than the idea of a national socialist revolution in Latin America." (For details, see an English translation of Hermann's work published in Covert Action Information Bulletin, Winter 1986)......

Moon's organization continued to flaunt ints new-found influence in Bolivia. On may 31, 1981 Moon representatives sponsored a CAUSA rreception at the Sheraton Hotel's Hall of Freedom in La Paz. Bo Hi Pak and Gen. Garcia Meza led a prayer for President Reagan's recovery from an assasination attempt......

During the 1980's, Moon's organization demonstrated unprecedented financial strength. In 1982, Moon launched The Washington Times a right wing daily that cost Moon an estimated $100million/year in losses. In 1983 Moon established a financial base in Uraguay with the purchase of the country's third largest bank, the the Banco de Credito, which soon became the center of allegations about money laundering. (For details, see iF Magazine, Sept.-Oct. 1998.

Moon's CAUSA also continued to organize pro-contra rallies in the United States and coordinated contra activities with the right-wing forces in Honduras and other Central American countries. Through the 1980's, Moon's Washington Times aggressively defended the contra operations raised money for the contras after Congress cut off funding. In 1984, the Times also published the first reports about Sandinista drug suspicions, a story that helped the contra cause in Congress while killing a major DEA investigation of the Medellin carte."

It should be noted that when George Bush became drug czar during the Reagan Administration, hard drug importation increased 1000% according to Brig. General Russell Bowen in his book "Immaculate Deception". Poppy also removed the only federal program that addressed money laundering, a vital component of drug dealing as cited in Noam Chomsky's "Chronicles of Dissent".
XicanoPwr
If you really like to read a scary story....Here is a good link.

http://www.geocities.com/craigmaxim/p-poli...eorgewbush.html
farmerTom
I don't think the Bush's are Moonies, I think if you giving enough money they will get up in front of any crowd and say about anything. It’s like they are political "call guys".
Bush Sr. when he was Ambassador to China got the idea that when ever this (China) goes free enterprise he'll have a giant gold mine. Look now Bush Sr will be at a gathering to publicly speak for a price at a drop of a hat. Neil has permanently stationed himself there to take advantage of the "business Johns" that need servicing.

I think we need to find a leader for this country that has more compassion for humanity and strength for true democracy then personal greed for money and power. After all they are steeling from us, they take our creditably in the face of the citizens of the world, they take our hard earned money only to loose it in another cover up for their stupid political blunders. If we don't manage to impeach this "poor quality" president then we should at least start shopping for a good affordable replacement that has good mileage for our democracy and an excellent warranty for compassion to the world’s population.

wink.gif
edowling
As a religious person, and upset that religion has been used by Bush to gain political ends (which cannot be denied), I am grateful to you for including these articles here. The "enemy of my enemy" is not my friend. Whether Moonies or Opus Dei, many such groups seek power. Whether or not they have power can be measured in such things as gold watches given out for carrying out their aims, and it can be measured in whether or not their directives are followed. It must be remembered that the Nazis pretended to be Christian as long as it suited them, but they were also anti-Christian.

A Korean Moonie who identified himself as representing and collecting money for the Unification Church came to my door on October 31, 2004. He was jingling chimes, so I thought it was a child in a costume, and I grabbed some candy (to respectfully remember the dead) and opened the door before looking through the peephole (won't do that again). There was this man, with a heavy accent, "selling" the chimes to support his church, which, when I found out which church it was, I refused. This was in Akron, Ohio; and there is no way that it could have been a coincidence that it was three days before the election. I have never before or since had a visit from anybody from the Unification Church.

I wondered, what were these representatives from the Unification Church suddenly doing in Akron? Certainly, with all the money in that church, they were not there to collect money... how about to distribute money... but how would one find out? As I said in a previous post, the DNC and others need to put their money not only into lawyers, but into an army of private detectives.
FormerCIA
QUOTE(farmerTom @ Dec 31 2004, 08:07 AM)
I don't think the Bush's are Moonies, I think if you giving enough money they will get up in front of any crowd and say about anything. It?s like they are political "call guys".
Bush Sr. when he was Ambassador to China got the idea that when ever this (China) goes free enterprise he'll have a giant gold mine. Look now Bush Sr will be at a gathering to publicly speak for a price at a drop of a hat. Neil has permanently stationed himself there to take advantage of the "business Johns" that need servicing.

I think we need to find a leader for this country that has more compassion for humanity and strength for true democracy then personal greed for money and power. After all they are steeling from us, they take our creditably in the face of the citizens of the world, they take our hard earned money only to loose it in another cover up for their stupid political blunders. If we don't manage to impeach this "poor quality" president then we should at least start shopping for a good affordable replacement that has good mileage for our democracy and an excellent warranty for compassion to the world?s population.

wink.gif
*


Anybody want to chip-in and buy Fearless Leader a pair of knee pads? lol.gif
farmerTom
QUOTE(FormerCIA @ Dec 31 2004, 08:34 AM)
Anybody want to chip-in and buy Fearless Leader a pair of knee pads? lol.gif
*


As it has became very clear as of late it's not just one Bush but it appears to be the family, their close friends, and their close business ties. I think we ought to spread tacks on the floor, not buy them knee pads, all the people that are paying out these big bucks are actually trying to buy credibility for their interest, so in a sense we are getting ripped off because the people that are swayed by this credibility are actually associating the US with these speakers. mad.gif
grammydidi
QUOTE(FormerCIA @ Dec 31 2004, 10:34 AM)
Anybody want to chip-in and buy Fearless Leader a pair of knee pads? lol.gif
*



If you have anything left over after you get the knee pads, you might consider a washcloth and a bottle of mouthwash as well!!!!! (Just in time for the inaugaration parties, of course.)

lol.gif
kgdowling
Thank you for that information. It explains everything I have observed about GWBush.

Typical of the Bush family: they team up with Moon, a former weapons dealing war monger who preaches an apocalyptic message that is palatable to the right wing types.

I was introduced to Moon's doctrines while at Fordham U studying religious history. His group gave lectures on campus and thought they were making headway because they were asked so many questions. Fact was that Fordham's theo majors never thought to be able to talk to anyone who actually believed the Arian heresy, a paganized form of Christianity that was rejected by all of the churches in 325 AD. The idea that Christ was a pagan superman, and not God the Son sold well to the Roman upper class of its day but it was rejected at the insistence of such leaders as Saint Nicholas of Myra (aka Santa Claus). Sadly it keeps coming back, especially among the theologically challenged rich right wing types.

Sadly they want to shove it down everyone's throats just like the rest of their morally bankrupt, anti-Christian policies. They do not follow Christ's agenda to build His charitable kingdom: they are goats with out Christian Charity, pretending to be sheep.

Sorry to be preachy. It is my primary job.
KGD (Most Reverend)
kgdowling
Thank you for that information. It explains everything I have observed about GWBush.

Typical of the Bush family: they team up with Moon, a former weapons dealing war monger who preaches an apocalyptic message that is palatable to the right wing types.

I was introduced to Moon's doctrines while at Fordham U studying religious history. His group gave lectures on campus and thought they were making headway because they were asked so many questions. Fact was that Fordham's theo majors never thought to be able to talk to anyone who actually believed the Arian heresy, a paganized form of Christianity that was rejected by all of the churches in 325 AD. The idea that Christ was a pagan superman, and not God the Son sold well to the Roman upper class of its day but it was rejected at the insistence of such leaders as Saint Nicholas of Myra (aka Santa Claus). Sadly it keeps coming back, especially among the theologically challenged rich right wing types.

Sadly they want to shove it down everyone's throats just like the rest of their morally bankrupt, anti-Christian policies. They do not follow Christ's agenda to build His charitable kingdom: they are goats with out Christian Charity, pretending to be sheep.

Sorry to be preachy. It is my primary job.
KGD (Most Reverend)
so angry I could spit
QUOTE(PaineInTheArse @ Dec 30 2004, 09:36 PM)
Are Moon's activities even on the radar screens of mainstream/non-fundamentalist churches and synagogs and mosques?
*


I don't know about churches or mosques, but in general synagogues just consider the Moonies a cult and will caution parents sending their kids away to college to keep an eye out for susceptibility to cults. Most synagogues focus on "Messianic Jews" ("Jews for Jesus") as the biggest "religious" group to keep on their radar.
edowling
QUOTE(so angry I could spit @ Dec 31 2004, 12:34 PM)
I don't know about churches or mosques, but in general synagogues just consider the Moonies a cult and will caution parents sending their kids away to college to keep an eye out for susceptibility to cults.  Most synagogues focus on "Messianic Jews" ("Jews for Jesus") as the biggest "religious" group to keep on their radar.
*


And something could be said about that group too... they don't particularly have much Christian theology either...

It is always a good idea to give warnings to college kids (if they will listen), but that is like telling kids to "just say no" to drugs, when the problem with these cults is much deeper than a few kids membership... Should we warn politicians away from such groups, when they are always looking for campaign contributions? Would the politicians listen to our "just say no" pleas?
FormerCIA
QUOTE(edowling @ Dec 31 2004, 01:49 PM)
And something could be said about that group too...  they don't particularly have much Christian theology either... 

It is always a good idea to give warnings to college kids (if they will listen), but that is like telling kids to "just say no" to drugs, when the problem with these cults is much deeper than a few kids membership...  Should we warn politicians away from such groups, when they are always looking for campaign contributions?  Would the politicians listen to our "just say no" pleas?
*


Good to see Rev. Dowling here smile.gif

In these days when you need lots of cash and lots of friends to stay in office, the mere will of the electorate doesn't mean much anymore. This so called election will prove once and for all that money and power begats money and power, electorate be damned.
so angry I could spit
QUOTE(edowling @ Dec 31 2004, 02:49 PM)
And something could be said about that group too...  they don't particularly have much Christian theology either... 
*


they don't? what the heck is their purpose then?
kgdowling
QUOTE(so angry I could spit @ Dec 31 2004, 05:37 PM)
they don't?  what the heck is their purpose then?
*


Good question. It would not be the first time that ideology was used as a front for other agenda: money and power in this case.

KGD
FormerCIA
QUOTE(kgdowling @ Jan 2 2005, 02:45 AM)
Good question.  It would not be the first time that ideology was used as a front for other agenda: money and power in this case.

KGD
*


Because churches are protected from scrutiny by law enforcrment and their tax-exempt status protects them from financial oversight, they make a very attractive vehicle for criminals to engage in their trade. This is not a new phenomenon, just the scale of it boggles the mind.
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