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rox63
This article lays out a good case on what the anti-gay and supposedly pro-straight-marriage aspect of the right-wing's 'culture war' is all about. It's about maintaining gender-inequality and male power. Comments, anyone?

http://dissidentvoice.org/July05/Goldsmith0725.htm

QUOTE
Focus on the Father
Part One: Dog Whistle

by Patricia Goldsmith
www.dissidentvoice.org
July 25, 2005

The continuing intense polarization of our country is a direct result of the dominant Republican Party’s refusal to fragment, even in the face of massive corruption, ongoing scandals, and George Bush’s free fall in the polls. This unity is made possible, no doubt, by corporate ownership of the media, but it is driven by a wartime mindset -- and I don’t mean Iraq.

As far as most liberals are concerned, however, the Culture War is like a high-pitched dog whistle: outside their range of perception. But you better believe the attacks dogs of the right hear it. There is a reason they all start howling at the same time.

Bill Clinton was different. His success was based on understanding the Culture War in his bones. I believe his tactics were often misguided, but there is no doubt that he saw a country splitting along ideological lines and, for a time, managed to keep the rift from exploding. Or rather, he limited the explosions to his own person. That explains why Clinton, who really was a uniter, is most often described as a polarizing president. He was always, for better or for worse, aware of the alternate reality being promulgated by the rightwing education/spin/attack machine, and he was always reaching out across the lines, refusing to let them harden.

Clinton advised gay people to come out: “Just keep telling your stories.” He changed the environment in which we live, by responding emotionally and symbolically. When Matthew Shepard was murdered, for example, Bill Clinton treated it as if it were an important event. He mourned. This was the first time in my memory that a hate crime against a homosexual received respectful national attention.

What Clinton did was so powerful that the right, always alert to the emotional impact of symbols, has latched onto Matthew Shepard for its own purposes. In a little-noted but extremely frightening gesture, George Bush made October 12 National Defense of Marriage Day.  It just so happens that October 12 is the date of Matthew Shepard’s death.  This is one of those coded messages George Bush is always sending to “the base” -- and what an unintentionally apt name that is in this case.

Clinton, always straddling the divide, balanced his emotional support of basic gay rights with “compromise” legislation like Don’t Ask/Don’t Tell, which was an unmitigated disaster, causing the outing and dismissal of untold numbers of gay people in the military. He also supported DOMA, the federal Defense of Marriage Act, which provides that same-sex marriage is limited to the states that pass such laws and cannot be used to argue for marriage rights in other states.

Intentionally or not, I believe Clinton did us a favor with DOMA, buying precious organizing time for gay rights organizations, and spurring us to pursue domestic partnership benefits state by state, in court, and in the corporate world.  It has been a solid success. Indeed, as civil liberties have been shrinking in general, gay rights, almost uniquely, have bucked the trend.

In “Beyond Gay Marriage,” in the July 18/25 issue of The Nation, Lisa Duggan and Richard Kim note that “ . . . there is increasing support for basic gay human rights.  Large majorities favor employment and housing rights for gay people (89 percent in the latest Gallup poll), and a clear majority of Americans support some form of partnership recognition for same-sex couples -- either marriage or civil unions (60 percent at the time of the election).”  More importantly, we all know the statistics showing that opposition to gay marriage is generational, suggesting that in 20 or 30 years, there will be majority support for full gay equality.

The right wing is very well aware of these statistics, too; they need accurate information just as much as we do when it comes to devising winning strategies. Let’s never forget that Karl Rove made his money as a direct-mail marketer; he has a very sophisticated understanding of demographics.  The difference between the left and the right, when it comes to polling, is that the right uses polls to devise winning strategies, while the left uses polls to set goals.  But what is most critical -- and this is Rove’s genius -- is the ability to understand exactly what it is that is being measured.

I received a vital bit of information on that subject when I read Gene Gerard’s recent article, “Gay Marriage Critics Are Misguided.” (Dissident Voice, July 14, 2005) Gerard cites a study by Steven P. Martin, which not only shows that the statistical factor most closely correlated with divorce is lack of education, but that lack of education among women is the strongest predictor of divorce.   Women who have graduate degrees have only a 15 percent divorce rate after ten years of marriage, as compared to 39 percent of women who have not finished high school, a whopping 24 percent difference. Men with the same educational levels show only a five percent difference in divorce rates.

Martin’s study fit snugly with another well-known statistical pattern: the fact that red states have higher divorce rates than blue ones. Tellingly, the state with the lowest divorce rate is also the sole state to legalize gay marriage: Massachusetts.  Other deep blue states with some of the lowest divorce rates in the country are Vermont, New Jersey, and Connecticut, all of which have some sort of civil union laws for gay people. 

Conversely, the Bible belt states of Texas, Florida, and Oklahoma, among many others, have some of the highest divorce rates in the nation.

Less well known, perhaps, is research -- carried out by a born again Christian, no less --that shows that fundamentalist Christians are among those with some of the highest divorce rates in the country.

Taken together, these studies demonstrate, first and most obviously, that gay marriage correlates positively with low divorce rates.  To liberals, these statistics are solid evidence that convincingly rebuts charges about the apocalyptic effect of gay marriage on the traditional institution. But liberals and conservatives are not measuring the same things.  We can only make sense of conservative claims if we understand that what is at stake is not the actual institution of marriage, which can be measured in statistical terms, but the continued existence of a certain hierarchy of power relationships, especially within marriage and families.

Put it this way: it’s similar to the difference between being genetically and anatomically male and being what Dobson and others might think of as “a real man.”

If we then realize that women’s lack of education is a significant quantifier of female inequality, the correlation between women’s lack of education and divorce meshes beautifully with statistics about higher break-up rates in Bible belt states and among self-described born-again Christians. It makes perfect sense that a man who requires an unequal relationship, one who believes in hierarchy and traditional male privilege, might wed a woman with little education and few economic options. Problem is, the real world -- or the wicked world, depending on your point of view -- offers women too many easy outs from their proper, traditional role.

That is why James Dobson, founder of Focus on the Family and author of Marriage Under Fire:  Why We Must Win This Battle, is intent on opposing not just the radical human equality of gay marriage, but many other measures that support women’s equality: no-fault divorce, economic benefits/rights for heterosexual cohabitation outside of marriage, abortion, and even easy adult access to contraception.  If there were truth in advertising, Dobson would have to call his group Focus on the Father.

Dobson’s definition of a good, biblically sound marriage rests almost entirely on strictly defined gender roles [Marriage Under Fire, pp. 11-12]:

When a wife believes in her husband and deeply respects him, he gains the confidence necessary to compete successfully and live responsibly. She gives him a reason to harness his masculine energy -- to build a home, obtain and keep a job, help her raise their children, remain sober, live within the law, spend money wisely, etc. Without positive feminine influence, his tendency is to release the power of testosterone in a way that is destructive to society at large…. Successful marriages serve to “civilize” and domesticate masculinity, which is not only in the best interests of women, but is vital for the protection and welfare of the next generation.

And what do women get out of the deal?  Well . . . men.  Isn’t that enough?

Conversely, a woman typically has deep longings that can only be satisfied through a romantic, long-term relationship with a man. Her self-esteem, contentment, and fulfillment are typically derived from intimacy, heart-to-heart, in marriage.

It’s important to remember that not all religious people, including evangelicals, see things the way dear old Dobson does.  David G. Myers and Letha Dawson Scanzoni point out in their book, What God Has Joined Together? A Christian Case for Gay Marriage (pg. 112), “Many Christians believe that the key to a successful marriage is a mutually supportive relationship in all areas of life.”

Gay relationships are dangerous to Dobson’s concept of marriage precisely because they are not based on gender inequality. To the extent that gay relationships do model gender inequality, as in butch-femme role-playing but also in terms of our sometimes ambiguous gender presentation, they act as a critique of male/female power relationships, which to someone like Mr. Dobson must feel like lampooning.   Above all, the Culture War is about men like James Dobson, male privilege, and “the power of testosterone” -- which he might as well just call power.

The Culture War is a fight for equality. It’s time we all enlisted.

-----
Patricia Goldsmith is a member of Long Island Media Watch, a grassroots free media and democracy watchdog group.
Gabrielle
Rox, I think the anti-gay movement is about the repressed homosexual impulses of right-wing males. But that's just my 2cents.gif
Pkemp22402
QUOTE(rox63 @ Jul 26 2005, 10:31 AM)
This article lays out a good case on what the anti-gay and supposedly pro-straight-marriage aspect of the right-wing's 'culture war' is all about. It's about maintaining gender-inequality and male power. Comments, anyone?

http://dissidentvoice.org/July05/Goldsmith0725.htm
*



I think it is interesting that states allowing Civil Unions for Gay Couples have a lower divorce rate than in states that don't. By allowing gay couples to affirm themselves together in a union, it seems we have decreased the need for a gay person to succumb to pressure, to marry heterosexually despite their sexual orientation, which is also sometimes cause for divorce.

So when we look at gay marriage, and gay rights, what should we be concerned about.... really? IMO it is undue influence of the gay lifestyle, or any personal lifestyle, on society as a whole. The question seems to be then, what is undue?

"Rox, I think the anti-gay movement is about the repressed homosexual impulses of right-wing males. "

For everyone, undue influence of the gay lifestyle on society, seems to be different. However, I think it is helpful to point out, that in respect to homosexuality, it is usually the people that talk about it, fight it, and oppress it the most that have the hardest time dealing with it. What defines "dealing with it" could mean many different things and, IMO would be inherent in how one grows up. So, a person with a conservative background, is probably more likely to have problems with it due to the nature of their upbringing, as the level of exposure to things that conflict with their beliefs is usually minimal. It has been my experience that, many of those, who are brought up with hard core conservative values experience a high amount of difficulty in almost any situation that contains issues reflecting ideals and/or experiences that are not conforming to their own. Therefore, creating for themselves, constant social friction, that creates high stress environments for the conservative on a consistent basis.

The movement we are currently seeing in our country is a well thought out effort by about 25-30 percent of the population to combat and suppress the "situations that cause them social stressors". That is why so much of what is done, excludes so heavily, as anything relational that seemingly creates problems is squashed down to a level of powerlessness, in order to reduce the chances significantly that a conservative will have to deal with it. Their actions in government have been extreme because their numbers are dwindling and it takes wider sweeping reforms to deal with those that don't hold conservative values. You can apply this to almost any relational dynamic: "Male to Female", "Heterosexual to Homosexual", "Young to Old","Man to Nature", etc. IMO, these individuals need education to develop more sophisticated social skills, in order to better deal with things that don't necessarily conform to their own specific values and ideals, while still remaining strong in personal belief.

I don't think that the conservative voice should be excluded from our government all together as they are citizens of this country too and therefore should be heard. However the problem seems to be that they don't want to adjust laws to better reflect their ideals, they want to completely rewrite them.

Social issues and civil rights issues don't require a total forfeiture of the law. The best thing to do is use the system that we have, work within our own boundaries, and create new ones as needed to include everyone.
mommadona
Anyone else getting sick of hearing the "Miller Lite" dude's voice-over on ALL the RW/Republican commercials lately....

Patrichial Papa Syndrome....

[SIZE=7]"Do as I say, not as I do, and BOY...bend over and git yer due"..
You OWE us this right, cause we are always, you see....
Nuthin' like a dose of "virginity" on a platter to sooth the ego of men.
That's the obsession - again and again....."/SIZE]

Yep, Roxie. You got it.

It IS a "male" thing.
It IS about the rightwing nut's closeted obsession with the "maleness" of being.

"LOVE ME, dammit...I DESERVE IT" because of the 6 inches of loose skin hanging.

It IS about the longest schlong....rightwingers are notorious for substituting guns/rockets/looong pointy things.....for their own in-adequate 6 inches of god-given real estate.

It's linear at it's most obscene. And the world has suffered long enough under this oppression.
And women "get" it. We just don't know what else but a lorna-bobbet to do about this constant "need" those "lil boys" have to stick it where it doesn't belong.

We could "do as the Romans do".....have penises in EVERY doorway, on every street corner.....a sign of defeat? You got "screwed" by your winner...literally.
Nothin' homosexual about it....it was the PRIZE. rolleyes.gif

And you wonder why Roman women stayed at home......
dggfwtx
Interesting theory.

One quibble with the article though. I don't think we can say that support for gay marriage has any effect on the heterosexual divorce rate. Rather, it is more than likely an outgrowth of the lower divorce rate. By that I mean that people who are in more stable, long-term relationships tend to be better educated, more mature, more self-assured, etc. So, therefore, they are more likely to support marriage equality.

Cause and effect can be folly to equate sometimes. A couple of weeks ago I read a story that said that people who drink diet soft drinks are *more* likely to gain weight. Well, at first glance this seemed preposterous. Obviously the diet soft drinks do no cause people to gain weight. But people who drink diet soft drinks are more likely to have a weight problem, and thus more likely to gain weight. The diet drinks do not cause the weight issue but are a sign of it.

In the same way, I would guess that support for same-sex marriage does not promote stable heterosexual marriage but is a reflection of it.
rox63
I think the real tipping factor here is education and gender-equality. States where same-sex unions are legal tend to have a higher level of education, more opportunities for women, and a lower divorce rate.
Pkemp22402
QUOTE(dggfwtx @ Jul 26 2005, 06:48 PM)
Interesting theory.

One quibble with the article though. I don't think we can say that support for gay marriage has any effect on the heterosexual divorce rate. Rather, it is more than likely an outgrowth of the lower divorce rate. By that I mean that people who are in more stable, long-term relationships tend to be better educated, more mature, more self-assured, etc. So, therefore, they are more likely to support marriage equality.

Cause and effect can be folly to equate sometimes. A couple of weeks ago I read a story that said that people who drink diet soft drinks are *more* likely to gain weight. Well, at first glance this seemed preposterous. Obviously the diet soft drinks do no cause people to gain weight. But people who drink diet soft drinks are more likely to have a weight problem, and thus more likely to gain weight. The diet drinks do not cause the weight issue but are a sign of it.

In the same way, I would guess that support for same-sex marriage does not promote stable heterosexual marriage but is a reflection of it.
*


I see your point. There are surely other contributing factors to the lower divorce rates, all of which you mention. Cause and effect are hard to equate but can be tested through research, and measured to a degree of likelyhood and unlikelyhood. I base most of what I say on what apparantly seems to be the most consistent problem Dems have with the Repub's - they don't change things a little, they make sweeping reforms with reasoning that evades everyone but those that think exactly like they do.
Pkemp22402
QUOTE(mommadona @ Jul 26 2005, 06:44 PM)
Anyone else getting sick of hearing the "Miller Lite" dude's voice-over on ALL the RW/Republican commercials lately....

Patrichial Papa Syndrome....

[SIZE=7]"Do as I say, not as I do, and BOY...bend over and git yer due"..
You OWE us this right, cause we are always, you see....
Nuthin' like a dose of "virginity" on a platter to sooth the ego of men.
That's the obsession - again and again....."/SIZE]

Yep, Roxie. You got it.

It IS  a "male" thing.
It IS about the rightwing nut's closeted obsession with the "maleness" of being.

"LOVE ME, dammit...I DESERVE IT" because of the 6 inches of loose skin hanging.

It IS about the longest schlong....rightwingers are notorious for substituting guns/rockets/looong pointy things.....for their own in-adequate 6 inches of god-given real estate.

It's linear at it's most obscene. And the world has suffered long enough under this oppression.
And women "get" it. We just don't know what else but a lorna-bobbet to do about this constant "need" those "lil boys" have to stick it where it doesn't belong.

We could "do as the Romans do".....have penises in EVERY doorway, on every street corner.....a sign of defeat? You got "screwed" by your winner...literally.
Nothin' homosexual about it....it was the PRIZE. rolleyes.gif

And you wonder why Roman women stayed at home......
*


Funny you mention the Roman's....... I think conservative leaders in our country need to keep one thing in mind. Many of our conservative religions were developed from Roman times in the tradition of Roman law. If history serves me, Rome Fell. Do we really want to base our laws on religions that have tradition in Roman Law if Roman society didn't even make it? If we introduce these religions into our system, won't this create the same divisions in our society that were in Roman Society, ultimately leading to its extinction?

Wouldn't we want the basis of our democracy to be on traditions we know America was formed on? Our government is not traditionally steeped in Roman influence, but NATIVE AMERICAN CULTURE and LAW. Wouldn't it be a smart idea to make laws, and government reform consistent with the traditions of the Native Americans?

I grew up with my mother teaching me about her Native American ancestors. One of the things I was taught is, they had a lot of influence over the formation the American Government after the revolution, and often held office (Daughters of the American Revolution Historical Society). IMO, the current elected officials who choose to ignore and/or change this tradition to a more Roman society, runs the considerable risk of bringing on the downfall of our country.
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