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Full Version: DAA#6: National I.D. Cards are the Only Way
Common Ground Common Sense > Issues that Affect Our Lives > Civil Rights and Civil Liberties
billfmsd
I'd like to see all of these defeated. But it maybe asking too much. Here's the record so far:

DAA#1 Defeated
DAA#2 Alive
DAA#3 Defeated
DAA#4 Unchallenged
DAA#5 Unaddressed

Here's the next one:

National I.D. Cards are the Only Way.

Call it the 666 mark of the beast, 1984 police state, or whatever. I.D. theft is the fastest growing crime. People's credit records are being ruined over night requiring years to recover. Illegal immigration and the race to the bottom of the cheap labor slave state is unstoppable as long as corporations are allowed to buy politicians. Now Eliot Spitzer plans to give drivers licenses to illegal immigrants. It's not practical for employers to check the status of applicants without a national I.D. card.

We practically have national I.D. cards already. The social security number is in effect, a national I.D. card issued at birth. The drivers license is being used as a pseudo national I.D. card. Credit and debit cards are rapidly becoming required for any purchase and are linked to drivers licenses and SSN. More and more information about you is being tracked with every purchase and shared with anyone willing to pay for it. Autonomy is a scarce and diminishing luxury fewer and fewer of us can afford. So whether it's a card you carry in your wallet, a chip embedded in your body, or a DNA sample or retina scan taken at every transaction and linked to a federal central database, national I.D. cards are coming, and it's the only way.

Let's hear your counter-points or reasons you think it will not happen. Any takers? devil.gif
graham4anything
Dont bother they're here...

Every single thing I do is already tracked
I buy the morning newspapers using credit cards
I have E-Z pass, everytime I go through a tunnel or bridge or toll road
(And who knows whatelse they can track)

The supermarket knows what food I buy
The movie theater knows what I saw
The book store what I read
Nothing is unknown

I go to a hotel and charge things, they know
What I am watching,eating,drinking
Cameras everywhere know if I scratch my butt or pick my nose

They know more than Santa Claus, who knows if I been bad or good, where being good to the Bushies is not a good thing

My cell phones got those bluetooth chips (is that what it's called)

Let alone who I call
Let alone the internet thingydingy

There is nothing I pay for in cash, so every single thing is known
rla
I agree. I've been the odd man out on this issue for years. Because equal individual freedom and
secure national sovernty depends on open transparancy of Institutions and unquestionable Identification of Persons. I supported Hillary in supporting Gov. Spitzer's Initiative on Special Driving
permits...the first step to improving the social system is to perceive & conceive of How it works...
Not the idealized version or the Fearfull version put out by the Decider...Hillary and I are on the same side on this issue but for different reasons...
jeffmoskin
There is one way to positively deal with the ID problem that I have not seen discussed - - -

Each one of us knows the answers to perhaps 100 very personal questions (your first grade teacher, your first car, your first telephone number, etc, etc,) that could be placed on a secure national data base.

To check identity, a person might have to answer 5 of these at random with no errors. I think that it would be pretty hard to steal someone's ID with this system.

And it is low-tech. You don't need eye scanners or fingerprint readers.

Comments?
billfmsd
QUOTE(jeffmoskin @ Nov 2 2007, 05:03 PM) *
There is one way to positively deal with the ID problem that I have not seen discussed - - -

Each one of us knows the answers to perhaps 100 very personal questions (your first grade teacher, your first car, your first telephone number, etc, etc,) that could be placed on a secure national data base.

To check identity, a person might have to answer 5 of these at random with no errors. I think that it would be pretty hard to steal someone's ID with this system.

And it is low-tech. You don't need eye scanners or fingerprint readers.

Comments?
Then I.D. theft is a simple matter of memorization, especially if you have access to that database.

Next! devil.gif
jeffmoskin
QUOTE(billfmsd @ Nov 2 2007, 03:48 PM) *
Then I.D. theft is a simple matter of memorization, especially if you have access to that database.

Next! devil.gif

The database is only accessed by "trusted" people. Like Homeland Security Employees, but with some brains.

If you don't take that as a given, then NO system is immune to identity theft.

Besides, memorizing 100 Q and A is no trivial task - remember no mistakes allowed.
TheRestofUs
Hmmmm.
rla
QUOTE(jeffmoskin @ Nov 3 2007, 09:29 AM) *
The database is only accessed by "trusted" people. Like Homeland Security Employees, but with some brains.

If you don't take that as a given, then NO system is immune to identity theft.

Besides, memorizing 100 Q and A is no trivial task - remember no mistakes allowed.

Why not just accept the obvious...Individual Persons can not hide...We need to make this universal...
Not petty crooks nor Robber Barrons can hide also...
billfmsd
QUOTE(jeffmoskin @ Nov 3 2007, 09:29 AM) *
The database is only accessed by "trusted" people. Like Homeland Security Employees, but with some brains.
People who can be trusted like Michael Chertoff?

QUOTE(jeffmoskin @ Nov 3 2007, 09:29 AM) *
If you don't take that as a given, then NO system is immune to identity theft.
How would you steal my fingerprints, my retina, or my DNA?

QUOTE(jeffmoskin @ Nov 3 2007, 09:29 AM) *
Besides, memorizing 100 Q and A is no trivial task - remember no mistakes allowed.
Ever met or heard of a savant?
rla
Interpersonal Trust and Trustworthyness is the glue that hold's any Social System together...All
known social systems are barely hanging together...There is too little Inclussion comming from the Community and Nation and too little Connectivity comming from individual Persons... This is experienced by many as anomie or allienation, social system maladies...
rla
Identity concerns, and customary stimulation/activation levels must be achieved before Security
concerns come into play...except under catestrophic conditions where less and less is predictable
and decreassing uncertainty and increasing control has the highest priority in the system...the
facists are comming...
billfmsd
QUOTE(graham4anything @ Nov 2 2007, 02:24 PM) *
Dont bother they're here...

Every single thing I do is already tracked
I buy the morning newspapers using credit cards
I have E-Z pass, everytime I go through a tunnel or bridge or toll road
(And who knows whatelse they can track)

The supermarket knows what food I buy
The movie theater knows what I saw
The book store what I read
Nothing is unknown

I go to a hotel and charge things, they know
What I am watching,eating,drinking
Cameras everywhere know if I scratch my butt or pick my nose

They know more than Santa Claus, who knows if I been bad or good, where being good to the Bushies is not a good thing

My cell phones got those bluetooth chips (is that what it's called)

Let alone who I call
Let alone the internet thingydingy

There is nothing I pay for in cash, so every single thing is known
QUOTE(rla @ Nov 2 2007, 04:20 PM) *
I agree. I've been the odd man out on this issue for years. Because equal individual freedom and secure national sovernty depends on open transparancy of Institutions and unquestionable Identification of Persons. I supported Hillary in supporting Gov. Spitzer's Initiative on Special Driving permits...the first step to improving the social system is to perceive & conceive of How it works... Not the idealized version or the Fearfull version put out by the Decider...Hillary and I are on the same side on this issue but for different reasons...
QUOTE(rla @ Nov 3 2007, 01:43 PM) *
Identity concerns, and customary stimulation/activation levels must be achieved before Security concerns come into play...except under catestrophic conditions where less and less is predictable and decreassing uncertainty and increasing control has the highest priority in the system...the facists are comming...



I guess we have more devils than angels on this one. BWUHUHUHAHAHA HA HA HA HA!!!!!!!

devil.gif devil.gif devil.gif
rla
QUOTE(billfmsd @ Nov 4 2007, 03:14 PM) *
I guess we have more devils than angels on this one. BWUHUHUHAHAHA HA HA HA HA!!!!!!!

devil.gif devil.gif devil.gif

Happy Mad Sad Scared...three to one...
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