Well, America ....

And yes, the CANDID WORLD, too ....

IT IS NOW TODAY ....

Yesterday is now gone ....

AND TODAY, FINALLY, THANKS TO JOHN McCAIN, JOE LIEBERMAN AND SARAH PALIN, WE HAVE REAL ISSUES TO CONSIDER HERE IN OUR AMERICA BETWEEN NOW AND NOVEMBER, WHEN WE ALL GET TOGETHER TO SELECT OUR NEXT PRESIDENT AND COMMANDER-IN-CHIEF ....

And where to start, pray tell?

Well, how about with John McCain last night ....

According to the radio news this morning, John McCain made a surprise appearance at the RNC last night after Sarah Palin made it official that after John McCain leaves office, she is going to be the NEXT REPUBLICAN PRESIDENT of America, GOD HELP US ALL ....

To paraphrase John McCain last night after he took the stage to speak to the assembled roaring and cheering multitude:

"HEY BOYS (nudge, nudge, wink, wink, drool), CAN I PICK'EM (more drool and some covert ogling of Sarah Palin's butt), OR CAN I PICK'EM?"

Yes, America ....

Randy John McCain CAN pick'em, alright ....

He has not lost his eyes for the ladies, no sir .....

BUT ....

WHAT DOES JOHN McCAIN'S CHOICE OF WOMEN REALLY MEAN FOR OUR AMERICA?

Last night, of course, before John McCain's CHOICE OF WOMEN opened her mouth to firmly define herself in American presidential politics, we had no real way of knowing exactly who Sarah Palin was, outside of her having been a FASHION SHOW CONTESTANT who finished in SECOND PLACE, and a SPORTS COMMENTATOR ...

Now, of course, we also know that Sarah Palin is a HOCKEY MOM ....

In her own words, which we have to assume are truthful, she is a PIT-BULL WITHOUT LIPSTICK ....

Soooooo .....

Okay ....

Sarah, this is America, be what you will ....

And by God, YOU HAVE!

Yes, America, Sarah Palin has moved from the state house of Alaska to the BIG TIME here in America, and as an American disabled combat veteran, I am PROUD to have stood up for this country and its Constitution, and I am further PROUD to have shed my blood in Viet Nam so that today, right now as we speak in here, a woman like Sarah Palin can be AS EQUAL as any man in the Republican party in America today ....

Well, almost as equal, anyway ....

For she appears to still be SUBSERVIENT to John McCain and all the other OLD MEN who are the REPUBLICAN PARTY in America today ....

And the role that John McCain and these other OLD MEN have assigned to OUR SARAH, if I can endearingly call her that without it being construed as being sexist in tone or nature, IS FOR HER TO GO OUT AND ATTACK BARACK OBAMA ....

Yes, America ....

In her own words, Sarah Palin, who will be the next REPUBLICAN American president after John McCain, IS A PARTISAN ATTACK DAWG!

AND GOD BLESS SARAH PALIN FOR THAT, SAY I!

Because if it is nothing else, America stands for OPPORTUNITY, even when all people like Sarah Palin are going to do with that opportunity is to go out there on the NATIONAL STAGE and try to TEAR DOWN someone who Joe Lieberman himself said WAS A CREDIT TO AMERICA at the same REPUBLICAN NATIONAL CONVENTION ....

YES, AMERICA ....

I heard Joe Lieberman say it myself ....

BARACK OBAMA HAS A LOT TO OFFER OUR AMERICA!

That was just in the last day or so ....

SO WHAT THE HELL IS SARAH PALIN DOING, THEN, TRYING TO TEAR HIM DOWN?

What is up with that, America?

MIXED MESSAGES, INDEED ....

And so ....

"GOP rallies around Palin - From Rudolph Giuliani to former Hewlett-Packard CEO Carly Fiorina, speakers support McCain's running mate"

By JENNIFER A. DLOUHY, Washington bureau, Albany, New York Times Union

First published: Thursday, September 4, 2008

ST. PAUL -- Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin on Wednesday introduced herself to Americans as an "average hockey mom" turned "small-town mayor" whose experience running the nation's largest state qualifies her to serve as vice president alongside John McCain.

In an upbeat 40-minute speech that included repeated digs at Democratic presidential nominee Barack Obama, Palin sought to rebut critics who have taken aim at her short resume by noting her successful bid for "major ethics reform" in Alaska and her willingness to stand up to "entrenched" special interests in the state's capital.

"I took on the old politics as usual in Juneau, when I stood up to the special interests and the lobbyists and the Big Oil companies and the good ol' boys," Palin said during a prime-time address at the Republican National Convention.

"We shook things up and in short order we put the government of our state back on the side of the people."

"Our opponents in this presidential election seem to look down on (my) experience," Palin said, in an address to thousands of cheering delegates, Republican Party loyalists and other spectators crammed inside a hockey arena here.

But, Palin said, she had more management experience than Obama, a former community organizer in Chicago.

"I guess a small-town mayor is sort of like a 'community organizer' -- except that you have actual responsibilities," Palin quipped.

Palin's address came on the third night of the Republican National Convention as former New York City Mayor Rudy Giuliani and other Republicans sharpened attacks on Obama and delegates formally nominated their history-making ticket.

Palin directed pointed criticisms toward Obama, calling him a gifted speaker without a record of significant accomplishments during four years in the U.S. Senate or seven in the Illinois legislature.

"Listening to him speak, it's easy to forget that this is a man who has authored two memoirs but not a single major law or reform," Palin said.

"This is a man who can give an entire speech about the wars America is fighting and never use the word 'victory,' except when he's talking about his own campaign."

In contrast, Palin praised McCain as the "only ... man in this election who has ever really fought for you."

The stakes were high for Palin to prove herself as qualified to take over the nation's No. 2 job, because the 44-year-old governor was relatively unknown until McCain chose her as his running mate last Friday.

The pressure mounted this week, as Americans discovered the previously undisclosed pregnancy of Palin's 17-year-old daughter, Bristol, and learned more about the family melodrama at the core of a state ethics investigation into whether the governor pressured an Alaska official to fire her former brother-in-law.

Palin alluded to the nationwide media scrutiny, saying it was because she was "not a member of the permanent political establishment."

"I've learned quickly these past few days that if you're not a member in good standing of the Washington elite, then some in the media consider a candidate unqualified for that reason alone," Palin said, to boos.

"But here's a little news flash for all those reporters and commentators: I'm not going to Washington to seek their good opinion" but rather "to serve the people of this great country."

Palin subtly referenced her unmarried daughter's pregnancy and her youngest son's Down syndrome diagnosis by noting that her "family has the same ups and downs as any other, the same challenges, and the same joys."

Palin's husband and five children, as well as Bristol's boyfriend, Levi Johnston, joined her onstage after her speech to a deafening roar of applause and cheering.

McCain also made a surprise appearance to greet the family as delegates waved posters and cowboy hats in the air.

Throughout the day, Republicans defended Palin on the convention hall stage and in meetings with state delegations by launching an aggressive campaign against the media.

They charged journalists with being sexist in their coverage and subjecting Palin to tougher scrutiny than Obama's running mate, Sen. Joseph Biden.

Giuliani told delegates from New York state that reporters were engaging in gutter journalism, leading an unfair and "unrelenting attack" on Palin.

Arkansas Gov. Mike Huckabee, who rivaled McCain for the Republican presidential nomination earlier this year, decried the "elite media" he said had produced journalism "tackier than a costume change at a Madonna concert."

Republicans spent the third night of their nominating convention focusing on their presidential nominee's plans for the economy -- and sharply contrasting his experience and credentials with Obama's.

They also used the platform to toss red meat to hungry supporters with repeated digs at the Obama-Biden ticket.

For instance, Sen. Norm Coleman, R-Minn., referenced Obama's speech to a July rally in Berlin.

McCain would "rather spend his time creating 200,000 jobs in America than speaking to 200,000 Germans in Berlin," Coleman quipped, to laughter.

Huckabee said he was tired of hearing Democrats accuse Palin of having too little experience to be vice president.

"She got more votes running for mayor of Wasilla, Alaska, than Joe Biden got running for president of the United States," he said, to a roar of laughter and extended applause.

Giuliani used his rousing 25-minute speech to pitch McCain as the most qualified presidential candidate, saying he "has dedicated his life to the service of his country, (has) been tested time and again by crisis (and) is a true American hero."

Obama's resume, by contrast, features an Ivy League education and seven years in the Illinois state legislature "where nearly 130 times he was unable to make a decision yes or no (and) simply voted 'present,' " Giuliani said.

"He's never run a city."

"He's never run a state."

"He's never run a business," Giuliani said against a New York City backdrop.

"He's never had to lead people in crisis."

Giuliani called Obama "the least experienced candidate for president of the United States in at least 100 years," and quipped:

"This is no time for on-the-job training."

"Obama has never led anything," Giuliani continued.

"Nothing."

"Nada!"

"Nada!"

Because Palin has "led a city and a state . . . she already has more executive experience than the entire Democratic ticket," Giuliani said.

Linda Lingle, Hawaii's governor, also sought to bolster Palin's credentials, by noting that her role as Alaska's governor means she is also the commander in chief of the state's National Guard.

"I find it especially amusing that the other party says Gov. Palin lacks experience when their own candidates for president and vice president have no executive experience."

"Zero!" Lingle said, launching a rowdy chorus of "Zero! Zero! Zero!"

Earlier in the day, former New York Gov. George Pataki made the case for Palin in a brief speech to delegates from the Empire State.

"The executive experience you get being a governor is enormously valuable," Pataki said.

"There's no question in my mind that Sen. McCain and Gov. Palin would be an excellent team together."

Republicans waved posters proclaiming "Energy Independence" and "Prosperity," as speakers said McCain's economic policies would revive the nation's flagging economy.

"If we make the right choice ... American families will keep more of their hard-earned money," said Carly Fiorina, the former CEO of Hewlett-Packard.

And what better place to start than with this newspaper item right above here, folks ....

As I have said, YESTERDAY IS NOW GONE .....

And today is today ....

And thanks to the REPUBLICANS, in addition to snails and red wine and wings at HOOTER's, we also have some RED MEAT to chew on here ....

So start chewing if you care about America, folks ...

And so ...

I don't know... but everywhere I go... there I am.

I just got out of a meeting with my 2 bosses who are both Republicans. They were just totally ga-ga over Palin's speech. When I mentioned that I wasn't, they didn't want to know why...just that I apparently have "no common sense" and that being a Ron Paul supporter means I am throwing away my vote..to which I responded that I vote my conscience and don't give a rat's behind what the implications of that are. They refused to see that the Bush admin has done anything wrong and as far as they are concerned Obama will make the entire country a welfare state...nevermind that there was no welfare reform the entire time Bush has been in office.

Blind leading the blind. Pardon me while I go throw up.

Well, that's the way many republicans think and no other issues are of significant importance to them except expanded tax breaks for the very wealthy.

I know lots of them. Gag.

AND OF COURSE, EVEN A CURSORY LOOK AT THE PUBLIC RECORD SHOWS US THAT SARAH PALIN IS NOT BEING CANDID WITH US HERE ....

IN FACT, YOU COULD SAY THAT SHE WAS LYING TO US TO GAIN A PARTISAN ADVANTAGE FOR HERSELF IN THIS UP-COMING PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION HERE IN OUR AMERICA IN NOVEMBER ...

And make no mistake, folks ....

This race is not about John McCain ....

This race is about Sarah Palin ....

Unlike the unorganized democrats, the REPUBLICANS in America are looking out ahead YEARS in advance ....

They have the THOUSAND YEAR REPUBLICAN REICH to protect, after all, while all the democrats have is continued disorganization ...

BUT ..

I digress, and this is no longer about the democrats ....

THIS IS ABOUT SARAH PALIN AS OUR NEXT AMERICAN PRESIDENT AND COMMANDER-IN-CHIEF ....

Can we afford her?

Do we want her?

Questions of the day ....

And so ...

You and your shadow....

HEY!

WOW!

Me, too, NiteOwl ....

How about that, will you?

Is it existential, do you think?

If it is I've definitely got something screwed up... big time.

Well, amy, I personally think that we American citizens have been handed a very rare opportunity here, and if America is about nothing else, by God, it is about opportunity ....

And I really don't give a damn about what REPUBLICANS think ....

What I really care about is WHAT DO REAL AMERICANS who are not republicans think ....

And what I would like to focus on in here is the contrast between what Joe Lieberman said about Obama being a credit to this nation, and WHERE WE NEED TO GO as a nation in the first several months of NEXT YEAR, if we are to make an effort in this nation to END THE ETERNAL WARS that the republicans have now got us into, to OUR detriment as a people on the face of this earth ...

WHO REALLY IS THE BETTER CHOICE FOR OUR NATION RIGHT NOW IF WE WISH FOR PEACE IN OUR TIME?

Obama?

Or McCain ...

I know that I would say Obama, BUT ...

That is simply me, and this thread is not about me, it is about PRESSING AMERICAN ISSUES OF TODAY AND TOMARROW TO COME ...

And so ...

Personally I've lost my mind over this and don't know where to find it.
I'm Choosing hope over fear!

Well, NiteOwl, I certainly trust your judgment in here ....

If you find out that it is, and you manage to un-screw it, will you let me know how you did it, in case I'm actually in the same boat as you?

Thanks!

Well to me I don't know that it means much except that the GOP (and McCain) will pander in whatever manner possible to try to win.

I see it almost as sexist because they have picked an unqualified woman from a field of far more qualified women and they are using her for her appeal and her RW popularity. It's not about Palin, not about women of substance and all about purely political pandering.

Other than talking about how successful Palin will be in attracting others outsider her sphere of appeal I don't know what their really is to analyze.

HOW ABOUT SOME RATIONAL ANALYSIS, INSTEAD ...

And speaking of FEAR and FEAR-MONGERING, we all have to be aware that long about October 15th or so, the republicans are going to spring a NATIONAL SECURITY CRISIS on us, to:

a) SCARE THE BE-JEEEPERS OUT OF US SO THAT WE CANNOT THINK CLEARLY! (That is essential to the republicans keeping power here in America, having us SCARED); and

b) SHOW JOHN McCAIN AND SARAH PALIN AS BEING IN CONTROL HERE IN AMERICA, JUST AS AL HAIG WAS IN CONTROL BACK WHEN ...

And so ...

I would not focus on her being unqualified so much as her being more of a movement, fringe-type politician as opposed to a problem-solving, mainstream-type politician. Which kind do most of the public want?

The Palin nomination is one huge frolic and detour. And I daresay, it will be successful.

It is code for many things including sexism, and class. it won't be long before common

parlance will allude to it as The Palin Effect.

What there is to analyze is her speech last night, which we really need in here ....

And Joe Lieberman's speech, as well, where he PRAISED Obama ...

And, NiteOwl ...

It is not enough to say it is PANDERING ....

OF COURSE IT IS ...

PANDERING has been a part of American politics for way too long now, in my estimation, anyway ...

BUT IS THAT GOOD OR BAD FOR AMERICA?

We American citizens need to ANALYZE HOW AND WHY!

We now have RED MEAT, NiteOwl ....

Let's start chewing on it ....

Sarah Palin is not a woman anymore ....

She is a DEFINED QUANTITY in American politics today ....

If we cannot demonstrate to a majority of RATIONAL Americans that based on who she herself says she is, she is BAD for OUR America, then we had better be prepared for the likelihood that we are going to be stuck with REPUBLICAN rule here in America for a long time to come, and Sarah Palin is going to be COMMANDER-IN-CHIEF of OUR nation's military ....

This is not about John McCain, and it is foolish to think that it is ....

It is about REPUBLICAN CONTINUITY of power here in America ....

We have had eight long years of it now ....

Between John McCain and Sarah Palin we are looking at AT LEAST TWELVE MORE YEARS of the same thing ....

Just different faces, is all ....

First John McCain ....

And then Sarah Palin ....

We have to emerge from here with a RATIONAL REBUTTAL, not as democrats, but as AMERICANS ....

This is not the nation of the republicans and the democrats and SCREW US ....

THIS IS OUR REPUBLIC ....

Do we want CHANGE?

Or do we want REPUBLICAN RULE?

It is that simple ....

And so ...

Liv

This is what Lieberman said of Obama - I wouldn't call it praise:

Senator Obama is a gifted and eloquent young man who can do great things for our country in the years ahead. But eloquence is no substitute for a record -- not in these tough times.

In the Senate he has not reached across party lines to get anything significant done, nor has he been willing to take on powerful interest groups in the Democratic Party.

Contrast that to John McCain's record, or the record of the last Democratic President, Bill Clinton, who stood up to some of those same Democratic interest groups and worked with Republicans to get important things done like welfare reform, free trade agreements, and a balanced budget.

Governor Sarah Palin, like John McCain, is a reformer who has taken on the special interests and reached across party lines. She is a leader we can count on to help John shake up Washington.

That's why the McCain-Palin ticket is the real ticket for change this year.

I really have to say Obama for a variety of reasons among which... McCain ascribes to the neo-con agenda and has expressed his willingness to follow right along which will lead to far greater potential for military conflict. McCain is not the most stable rock in the pile. McCain has a disconnect with real issues of working class America on almost all social issues, taxes, etc. McCain sold out his family in 2000 and sold out vets when he went with allowing torture. Those issues make McCain unacceptable to me.

Arneoker ...

I took GREAT PAINS in here, right off, to make it clear that YESTERDAY IS GONE ...

YESTERDAY, WE WERE IGNORANT ...

Last night, God bless her soul, Sarah Palin ended our collective ignorance by enlightening us as to who she really is, in her own words, and HER SUPPOSED QUALIFICATIONS are right in this little window above here, to wit:

Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin on Wednesday introduced herself to Americans as an "average hockey mom" turned "small-town mayor" whose experience running the nation's largest state qualifies her to serve as vice president alongside John McCain.

end quotes

What I am saying in here is that we all take her AT HER WORD ...

Let's all assume that she is being frank and candid in her own assessment of herself as "average hockey mom" turned "small-town mayor" whose experience running the nation's largest state qualifies her to serve as vice president alongside John McCain ....

Sooooo ....

Okay, Sarah ....

And the beauty here, Arneoker, is that I am from a small town myself, and Sarah has taken it upon herself to try and speak for people like me, who are from small towns here in America ....

We know from all of our discussions in my thread of yesterday, that like many or all of us in here, Sarah Palin is CONSTITUTIONALLY QUALIFIED to run for VP of OUR America ....

She is an American citizen, allegedly, and she is 44 years old ....

BUT SHE WANTS TO GO BEYOND THAT ....

And I say, LET HER ...

Give us more red meat, Sarah, I'm hungry!

And we have time to discuss things calmly and rationally in here, Arneoker ....

Get the emotion out, as it were ....

So why not take the OPPORTUNITY?

Because if it is nothing else, America is a LAND OF OPPORTUNITY ...

And we can use that OPPORTUNITY to END REPUBLICAN RULE here in America by demonstrating rationally that it is bad for America, starting with our ECONOMY, which is being BLED TO DEATH by these ENDLESS REPUBLICAN WARS ...

And so ...

Ya gotta admit, when was the last time an 18 year old kid got a roar of cheers and applause from thousands of strangers for a PE aborted hormone driven game of catch-me-before-I catch-you out of wedlock , huh ? A once in a lifetime experience.

There is no question that Fear Mongering has been a major Republican Strategy and Remains so...
We need to be aware of both our own Fear and Fear Mongering by the Republicans, and proceed with what we would do anyway, while giving ourselves verbal instructions to relax and thus extinquish some of
the fear. Livyjr, when you made the statement, "Psychology teaches that there are two motivations,
Greed and Fear," I went right out of default...I've studied Psychology an awfull lot and that's not
what it teaches me...

Damn right it is pandering...

Problem is that analyzing anything she said is not analyzing her positions but the points in her Rove speech.

Real answers would only be possible with a wholesale change in the political system to either a multi-Party system or no Parties (never happen). The system is so heavily protected to prevent any change that threatens the two parties that it will be nearly impossible to ever change it. The barriers are nearly insurmountable... on purpose. And... it is all gamed to make it a left / right paradigm where division is always assured. Division is what allows the rulers to remain in control. If we "the People" ever got to a point of really agreeing on all the major issues and we controlled our government then the PTB would no longer be able to control us. In essence their oligarchy would fall apart.

On the social issues, I would agree with your comments. But on foreign policy and the neocons, etc. I don't see any difference today.

I trust Obama to keep us out of a major conflict (like with Russia) at least a little bit more than McCain whose misplaced machismo is just a notch below Bush's... if at all.

Do you take issue with her characterization of people from small towns Liv?

She says:

"A writer observed: "We grow good people in our small towns, with honesty, sincerity, and dignity." I know just the kind of people that writer had in mind when he praised Harry Truman.

I grew up with those people.

They are the ones who do some of the hardest work in America ... who grow our food, run our factories, and fight our wars.

They love their country, in good times and bad, and they're always proud of America. I had the privilege of living most of my life in a small town."




I thought the above characterization was one of the more powerful elements of her speech. And I would add, most of the East Coast takes these people for granted.

I think that his machismo is a notch above Bush's, at least Bush right now, when he is just a bit more wiser and more cautious. Here freshness would be dangerous, McCain would be more raring to go with the policies that proved such a failure under Bush's first term.

Now McCain would probably try diplomacy more than Bush, and that would be good, but I think his conception of that is to primarily work with our old Western European allies. That is better than nothing, but I think Obama has a better sense that the rest of the world is rising and needs to be engaged more effectively.

What I would like to see come out of here, NiteOwl, is something short and to the point that can be sent out all over America by e-mail to demonstrate that between the candidates that we now have before us, regardless of his prior experience or lack thereof, Barack Obama is really the ONLY RATIONAL CHOICE ...

Saying what McCain did yesterday and $33.51 plus tax and gratutities will get you a LATTE EL SUPREMO GRANDE at Starbucks, due to the rampant inflation in America thanks to George W. Bush's ENDLESS WARS on borrowed money ....

The issue is not on YESTERDAY, anymore ....

The issue is on CHARACTER, and what is best for OUR America come January of next year ...

WHAT REALLY IS OUR MOST PRESSING PRIORITY?

I personally think it is about DIPLOMACY ....

Which is tied directly to our ECONOMY ...

While we are enmeshed in wars and conflicts all over Hell's half-acre and beyond, our economy is never going to recover ....

When plow horse are converted to war horses ....

And plow shares are forged into swords ....

A field of thorns is the harvest ....

And there is where we are right now, and there is where we will remain IF the republicans keep power here in OUR America .....

Even now, Dick Cheney is over in Georgia working to FOMENT a NATIONAL SECURITY CRISIS before this next presidential election ....

I figure that will happen somewhere in mid-October ....

That NATIONAL SECURITY CRISIS will eclipse any discussion that we are having right now, and it will take everybody's attention away from Barack Obama and it will focus it on the republicans and John McCain ....

It will be a REPRISE of 2004, except with a different NATIONAL SECURITY CRISIS ....

This time, Russia will be the BOOGEY-MAN ....

Sarah Palin is being touted as a NEW RONALD RAYGUN for America ....

Ronald Raygun was the REPUBLICAN who gave us the EVIL EMPIRE ....

Now we have republican Dick Cheney REVIVING that HATRED for Russia, calling it an INVADER of tiny, allegedly democratic Georgia, which is going to get a BILLION BUCKS from the republicans from our treasury to REBUILD what the INVADING RUSSIANS destroyed ....

We need to be able to counter that distraction, or I fear that we will be lost again here ....

You are a rational thinker, NiteOwl ....

Surely you can see where this is all going in the next several weeks leading up to November ....

CAN THE REPUBLICAN TRAIN BE DERAILED?

The question of the moment ...

And so ...

Arneoker, no offense intended, BUT YOU ARE TOO DAMN TENTATIVE here ....

In terms of diplomacy, Obama stands HEAD AND SHOULDERS above McCain ....

Obama has proven that by going over to Europe, where he was very well received ....

McCain cannot say the same thing, nor can the republicans ....

To the contrary, the republicans deride that experience of Obama's ....

BUT ....

In doing so, they deride us, as well ....

WHOEVER IS THE NEXT U.S. PRESIDENT WILL BE A DIRECT REFLECTION BACK ON US AS AMERICAN CITIZENS IN THE EYES OF ALL THE CANDID WORLD ....

I do not want to be seen by people in the rest of the world as some CLUB-WIELDING, KNUCKLE-DRAGGING, UNLETTERED BERSERK BARBARIAN ....

There is where George W. Bush and the republicans have ALL OF US right now, TARRED WITH THAT BRUSH ....

If America keeps the republicans in power, then that image will be reinforced, to our detriment ....

Obama has the power to dispel that NEGATIVE IMAGE of us as a people on the face of this earth of ours ...

DO WE WANT TO FOSTER A NEW IMAGE FOR AMERICA IN THE EYES OF THE WORLD?

I obviously can't speak for all Americans here, Arneoker ...

I can only present the question ....

And so ...

I've posted the same thing... as you know my thinking on Russia. Russia (via Georgia) is simply the new Iran. They know the focus is on Iran and yes... Russia is the next neo-con bogeyman. Russia doesn't even understand the reason for US' actions... but WE DO.

And yes... it is there last ditch effort to get us into something that the next President will have to follow through with. Neo-con even after they are gone... even if BO is elected he'll be stuck with it. And the cold (and maybe hot) war begins.

McCain is clearly the bigger danger here.

(more to follow... )

PEOPLE HEAR WHAT THEY WANT TO HEAR, AND DISREGARD THE REST, LA LA LA ....

I heard that said in a song one time, and I believe that it is true out there in real life ....

MANY ARE CALLED, FEW ARE CHOSEN ...

LEAVE THE DEAD TO BURY THE DEAD ...

Everybody who is unequivocally for John McCain and Sarah Palin can now leave ....

And God bless you for your certainty ....

Or stay, what the heck ....

WATCH, LISTEN, LEARN, RunsWithScissors ....

Observe these people ...

They are living their values each moment of the day, just as we are in here, and in the end, IT IS A QUESTION OF VALUES ....

DO YOU WANT TO BE LIKE YOUR BOSSES?

OR WOULD YOU RATHER BE LIKE YOURSELF?

In here, I am taking great pains to have this be a conversation among Americans, not a conversation among democrats ...

Certainly, there are people in here who are democrats, and I have nothing against that ....

I just don't want to be identified as a democrat myself, is all ...

It is too easy these days to dismiss democrats as a fringe ....

It is a lot more difficult for John McCain and Sarah Palin and the republicans to dismiss the AMERICAN PEOPLE as a lunatic fringe, especially when we don't portray ourselves as one by being one in here ....

THIS IS AN INTERNATIONAL FORUM ....

Right now, although they may never identify themselves or say a single word in here, people from all over the world are watching us in here, reading our words and considering who we are ....

We can thus isolate ourselves further from the rest of the world ....

Or by our words in here, we can make it damn clear that we are fellow human beings, LIKE THEM ...

And each of us can only speak for him or herself in here ....

SO WHERE ARE WE REALLY GOING TO BE PLACED, COME JANUARY?

Further towards turmoil?

Or heading for peace?

And it is not up to Barack Obama to make that decision, it is up to all of us, and even we are not enough ....

A majority of Americans have to make a choice as well ....

WHICH SIDE DO YOU WANT TO BE ON?

The side of a peaceful, rational America?

Or the side of a THUG?

And so ...

You're on the scent, NiteOwl ....

RED MEAT, dude ...

Go for it ....

It is only the future of our nation that we are considering in here ....

And you are right ....

If Obama is elected, he AND WE are all going to be confronted with this on-going MESS in Georgia ....

That is a MASSIVE REPUBLICAN BOMB that has got to be defused, or it is right back into all that COLD WAR BULL**** we are going ....

And that is going to destroy OUR economy this time, not Russia's ....

And so ....

So which one has the character and temperment to be President?

Every Entity has a structure and a process. Persons (Self) is structure and process, object and subject.The Universe is an Entity with structure and process, reducable to particles and waves...
The Person, personing, may be seen as a set of interacting Traits and States (structure and process). Our Traits provide
a predisposition to respond in certain ways which is further modified by the particular State we are in at the time and place...we are presently in the process of assessing typical traits and states of both candidates and how they are affecting the structure of their parties and resulting interactions...

In this case I don't think that the red meat eaters/dispensers are the ones with the temperment.

Well, Snuf, no, I do not take issue with her characterization ....

WHAT I DO TAKE ISSUE WITH IS THAT SHE SOMEHOW REPRESENTS ME AS A SMALL TOWN PERSON .....

OR IS SOMEHOW REPRESENTATIVE OF ME AS A SMALLTOWN PERSON IN AMERICA ...

APPLES AND ORANGES, Snuf ....

First of all, regardless of where she grew up, she left that all behind her; and I didn't ....

I am where I have been since 1949, for good or bad ...

DO YOU HEAD FOR THE STAGE LIGHTS AND THE BRIGHT LIGHTS OF BROADWAY?

She did ...

God bless her, Snuf, because if it is nothing else, America represents OPPORTUNITY ....

However, she is no longer a smalltown girl ...

She left that and us far behind her, is my thought, especially after considering her words in her speech to the republicans last night, where she has accepted the role of REPUBLICAN ATTACK DAWG in this up-coming presidential election ....

SHE IS A PARTISAN POLITICIAN NOW ....

Not a smalltown American ...

And to me, she is full of BULL**** when she says that she is not a WASHINGTON INSIDER ....

She is similarly full of BULL**** when she tries to tell me that she is not in bed with the Washington LOBBYISTS ....

And I think, based on an article that tazvil posted in this forum yesterday or so that Palin is full of BULL**** when she says that she had the interests of smalltown people like myself at heart when she ran for mayor of Wasilla ....

To the contrary, it is my impression from her last night and from that article, that she is HIGHLY PARTISAN ....

That is very devisive in a small town and it will be devisive here in America, as well ....

SHE SAYS SHE KNOWS SMALLTOWN PEOPLE, BUT I SAY THAT I AM ONE .....

She is not, no longer, no matter where she might have been born ....

Some of my favorite people up here, and some of the most honest that I know are the folks who work at the family sawmill just up the road where I buy all of my lumber ....

Those people are not like Sarah Palin, and she is not like them ....

The owner of that sawmill and myself disagree on a lot of things, but we need each other, and so, we get along ....

If he ***** me because he don't like me or my politics, and I don't come back, then he has cut his own throat a little ....

If I try to **** him back, and he goes out of business, then I have simply screwed myself the next time I need lumber ....

SO WE RISE ABOVE ....

And we don't care if we are taken for granted ....

That is merely a distraction ...

You get distracted by petty politics in a sawmill, and you are going to be missing parts ....

SARAH PALIN IS A DIVIDER ....

DIVIDERS ARE THE DEATH OF SMALL TOWNS IN AMERICA ....

We don't want them here where I am, although for the last eight years, we have been stuck with them ....

And they are DESTROYING OUR COMMUNITY ....

They are making it so we cannot afford to even live our lives here ....

You can't saw wood without some kind of fuel, Snuf ....

You can't saw lumber for long, if your customers can't afford to get there to buy it, or they can't afford to buy it, because it cost so much to saw ....

There is where I am, anyway ....

It's a small town view of things, I know ....

But that is it, nonetheless ....

And so ...

Personally I think that if Harry Truman could come back from the dead that he would eat Sarah Palin alive. She would not know what hit her.

But of course she can rest easily knowing that is not going to happen...

All in all, rla, I find Arneoker to be pretty objective and rational and un-emotional here in this forum ....

He will take criticism, and he will consider it, instead of getting all emotional about it ....

And I learn stuff from him, myself ....

I tend towards his analysis here ....

WHY DO YOU THROW OUT RED MEAT AT A POLITICAL CONVENTION, rla?

I think that that is something that you have to think about here ....

And as a corollary:

TO WHAT DO YOU THROW OUT RED MEAT TO?

And so ...

Ah, Arneoker ....

What a rejoinder!

Some folk wisdom, indeed ....

Are you from a small town, Arneoker?

No, although my parents are from a medium-sized town in Central Massachusetts, a good one and a half hours from the fancy precincts of the Boston metropolitan area. (And that is with the turnpike that didn't exist when they were growing up.)

Now I used to travel a lot, and I worked with a lot of small-town people. I learned a little bit about "diversity" first hand.

And I am no expert on Truman, but I understand that he was a fierce partisan and quite outspoken in what he said.

Right now, Arneoker, according to her own definition of herself last night, she is a PROBLEM-MAKER here in America ....

She is a DIVIDER, by intent ....

She is definitely not a problem solver ....

DO WE NEED A PROBLEM MAKER IN THE WHITE HOUSE?

If yes, vote McCain/Palin, your wish will come true ....

But God help the rest of us in America is my thought ....

And one thing that really troubles me about Palin in her acknowledged role as a PARTISAN ATTACK DAWG is this ethics cloud hanging over her head in Alaska where she allegedly used her office as governor to try and get her ex-brother-in-law fired as an Alaska state trooper ....

As a whistle-blowing public health engineer who was easily CRUSHED by corrupt republicans here where I am, I find myself very concerned at the thought of Palin in the White House with the power to reach out and SMACK ANY OF US DOWN here in America if the mood struck her to do so ....

That is very discomfiting ....

Very ....

And so ...

Can you consider Palin as she was last night at the RNC as one of them, Arneoker?

Did she represent smalltown Americans last night at the RNC, in your estimation?

I'm interested in your views ....

I'd be interested in rla's, as well ....

He was from a small town in America ....

And so ...

I hear you Livyjr. I am an ex-federal employee, present contract worker for the government. Now they can get rid of me at the drop of a hat. But I still worry about the federal service, and think that at a measure of civil service protection is important, to prevent political manipulation of the federal work force.

I guess the OPERATIVE QUESTION for all of us, Snuf, is how that all will manifest itself here in America between now and November ....

I DON'T WANT A FEMALE ATTACK DAWG IN THE WHITE HOUSE ANYMORE THAN I WANT A MALE ATTACK DAWG ....

God knows we don't need a female Dick Cheney in office with PMS ....

And with her, we are going to get one, it sounds like ....

RUN FOR THE HILLS, SARAH HAS HER PERIOD AGAIN AND SHE HAS A GUN!

And so ...

I think you start that process, Arneoker, by NOT PUTTING a KNOWN VINDICTIVE political manipulator in there in the first place ....

Obama has no history of that kind of conduct that I am aware of ....

Palin, on the other hand, remains under investigation ....

And she is relishing, in her own words, her role as a PARTISAN POLITICAL ATTACK DAWG ...

Once a dog is used to attacking, can you ever trust them again not to?

In the country, once a dog starts killing chickens, they never stop ....

And so ...

Livyjr, I don't disagree with any of this...I'm not sure of where our difference is if we have one...

She is Stealth, with considerable personal power and well integrated into a large number of powerfull
Political, Religous, and Financial Networks...the combination of Religous Power and Military Power
has always carried the day at the deep-state level of Analysis. That's what I think the McCain-Palin
ticket means...

Well, from what little I really know, here is what I think.

Small town folks, as a general rule (of course there are numerous exceptions) tend to be more conservative than big city folks. Her political ideology is probably not all that far from that of many, if not most, small town people.

But there is something else here. I think that this is one angry woman. I don't see most small town people as that angry. She seems to be resentful, with a big chip on her shoulder. Why, I can only offer essentially baseless speculation. But she is angry. Hence she seems to be more of a divider than a uniter.

I can remember going on a group birdwatching tour in Colorado. One night we were in this small mountain town. We were at this little restaurant, and talked to the owner who was a very friendly woman. It was mostly a Massachusetts group (100% if you count me as being from there). Anyway, she spoke about all of the different people who came through that town, and kept talking about how she loved having people over with "an accent". Here was a woman who knew something about appreciating diversity that I think goes beyond some of the fancy courses I took at my School of Education here in Northern Virginia.

She was not an angry woman. I would feel better with someone like her as President or VP than Sarah Palin. Even with political views that were no different. You know I never was a supporter of Ronald Reagan, but I appreciate that he was more of a uniter than a divider, with his optimistic outlook. A lot of conservatives worship Reagan, but a lot of those conservatives are very angry these days.

There are angry people everywhere, and they seem to be disproportionately represented in the political world, which is a shame. I think most small town people are not so angry. I think most big city people are not angry. Maybe they are angrier than small town people, but even they are mostly not angry.

I think Obama (despite the stereotype of the angry Black politician) is not an angry man. Passionate yes, angry no. Biden is not angry. But Palin is angry. And I think McCain is angry, he just suppresses it, until he loses his temper.

Thanks for retrieving that and posting it in here, Snuf ....

If we don't have it before us in here, then we can't talk about it very intelligently is my thought ....

And it says what it says .....

One thing that is not true in there is that Sarah Palin is a reformer ....

Another thing that does not appear to be true is that Sarah Palin reached across party lines ....

In fact, last night, it was made incandescently clear that she is not reaching across party lines at all ....

TO THE CONTRARY, SHE IS BUILDING A WALL ....

A PARTISAN WALL ....

ON PURPOSE AND WITH INTENT ....

SHE IS A DIVIDER DESPITE WHAT JOE LIEBERMAN MIGHT BE TRYING TO SELL US ....

The one key sentence in there that I wanted to focus attention on in this thread, for the sake of further discussion, is this:

Senator Obama is a gifted and eloquent young man who can do great things for our country in the years ahead.

IS THAT TRUE, Joe Lieberman?

And if so, why shoudn't he be doing those GREAT THINGS for us as OUR next president?

HELP US OUT HERE, Joe ....

DO IT FOR AMERICA ....

And so ...

You know I agree that she is stealth, but not in the bogey way that you are talking about.

They are definitely trying to conceal a lot of her views.

You have got good insights, Arneoker ....

I'm glad that you are in here for that reason ....

ANGER DESTROYS, Arneoker ....

It destroys individuals ....

It destroys families ....

It destroys communities ....

It destroys nations ....

ANGER CONSUMES ....

ANGER prevents reasoned judgments ....

Sarah Palin needs to do some maturing, some growing up ....

We do not need or want HER ANGER here where I am ....

WE ARE DAMN SICK AND TIRED OF ANGER LIKE HERS HERE IN OUR AMERICA ....

And yes, Arneoker, that does make us angry ...

We want peace in our own times ....

I am old ....

I want peace in my life ....

I am ******* sick and tired of all of this constant strife that George W. Bush and the republicans have dumped on our heads here in America ....

I WANT POSITIVE CHANGE ....

Palin and McCain do not promise that ....

They only promise more division and strife ....

And last night, Sarah Palin was relishing the prospects of delivering us another DOSE ...

So good-bye Sarah is my thought ...

Come back when you have grown up some ....

And so ....